Tour 2016---Thoughts???

[kevinuk81]

How many fans, casual or not, would know It's Hot Tonight and You Drive Me Nervous on the Brutal Planet tour? I certainly had not.

[Si]

How many fans, casual or not, would know It's Hot Tonight and You Drive Me Nervous on the Brutal Planet tour? I certainly had not.

True, but that was a different time.
Note that TF was played on the following tour, nothing else more recently.
Again, I'm not saying they shouldn`t be played, just offering a reason why they aren`t.

[Daggers & Contracts]

As I see this go on & on, one must realize that he has become an "Oldies" act.
After all he's no Spring Chicken. Whether or not he has "new" material - he'll more than likely only trot out two or maybe three of those, the majority of the rest will be "Classics". The newer fans he's picked up by his touring as an opening act is sure to boost ticket sales but those members will be coming for the show & maybe bringing one or two along for the experience. In this case too much change isn't good. We can only hope that they select a couple of rarely performed songs from the selections they receive. Sorry guys & gals!

[pitkin88]

June 8th 2014 Saint Brieuc, FR Festival Art Rock
Setlist: / House Of Fire / I'll Bite Your Face Off /Caffeine / Department Of Youth ( flop single )/ Dirty Diamonds (incl. drum solo)

There's a bunch of songs the average fan probably wouldn't know. So why couldn't he play the hard to remember 30 yrs ago metal dirge songs in their place?

House Of Fire = rare song from his best selling album
I'll Bite Your Face Off/Caffine - from the then current album+Face got a fair amount of exposure and worked well live.
Department of Youth - WAS a big hit in some parts of the world and is from one of his most successful and still popular albums.
Dirty Diamonds - used as the mid set break song, as was Halo, and the old Black Widow jam. (This is where My Stars would work). Also Alice apparently LIKES drum solos so adding that into the mid set break makes sense.

From all the Constrictor/RYF songs (he's back aside) the only one *I* can really see being added to the set is Freedom, but if it was (which is doubtful) I can`t see it sounding as "metal" as the RYF version.

Again: There is no reason a given song CAN'T be played, it's a choice based on what Alice/Shep/Bob think would work in any given show, and if Alice enjoys playing that song. Why do you think we get 'Lost In Americ' so much? Alice likes playing it. That is as valid a reason for a songs inclusion as any other. However if it killed the show stone dead it would probably be dropped.

Dept of Youth flopped in both the US and UK. According to the section here it was only a hit in Aus.

I'll Bite Your Face Off is just unknown. That album and Dirty Diamonds sold jack.

I am really of the belief he would need Kane back in if he were to play songs from the crap two. He knows this and that's why ( or he now thinks those two albums are cringeworthy ) non of those comeback songs are worthy of inclusion.

[pitkin88]

As I see this go on & on, one must realize that he has become an "Oldies" act.
After all he's no Spring Chicken. Whether or not he has "new" material - he'll more than likely only trot out two or maybe three of those, the majority of the rest will be "Classics". The newer fans he's picked up by his touring as an opening act is sure to boost ticket sales but those members will be coming for the show & maybe bringing one or two along for the experience. In this case too much change isn't good. We can only hope that they select a couple of rarely performed songs from the selections they receive. Sorry guys & gals!

Even the die hards here know the live stuff is stale and an oldies act. The imagination is all but gone. Living in hope for two or three new songs a tour is pretty sad.

[Si]

Even the die hards here know the live stuff is stale and an oldies act. The imagination is all but gone. Living in hope for two or three new songs a tour is pretty sad.

There were three songs from the last album of new material when that show started, although one was later dropped.

[Si]

Dept of Youth flopped in both the US and UK. According to the section here it was only a hit in Aus.

The album it was on didn`t. Are you now saying only hit singles should be in the show?

I'll Bite Your Face Off is just unknown. That album and Dirty Diamonds sold jack.

Yet both go down pretty well live. Have you noticed the audience losing interest during them. Yes, people lose interest during the drum solo, but then who doesn`t. Drum solos are always a hard sell.

I am really of the belief he would need Kane back in if he were to play songs from the crap two. He knows this and that's why ( or he now thinks those two albums are cringeworthy ) non of those comeback songs are worthy of inclusion.

I disagree and have shown that he HAS done TWO songs from those albums, proving that at least in part you are wrong.

You are, of course, entitled to your belief that they would need Kane (and I respectfully disagree), but that wasn't what started this conversation. You stated that Alice himself had stated that the band couldn`t play the songs. I would need to see the quote you are basing all this one in context. I honestly can`t see him ever saying such a thing about a current band he was working with.

[A_MichaelUK]

From pitkin88:
"Shouldn't these songs be well known as they started the comeback?"

How can they be when the album they were on wasn't hugely successful?

[pitkin88]

From pitkin88:
"Shouldn't these songs be well known as they started the comeback?"

How can they be when the album they were on wasn't hugely successful?

but the tour was.

[A_MichaelUK]

From Si:
"Have you noticed the audience losing interest during them."

There is no point in asking him because he doesn't go to the shows and he admits it, which is why so many of his opinions don't reflect the reality.

[A_MichaelUK]

pitkin88 wrote:
"I am really of the belief he would need Kane back in if he were to play songs from the crap two. He knows this and that's why ( or he now thinks those two albums are cringeworthy ) non of those comeback songs are worthy of inclusion."

So aren't more songs from "Muscle Of Love" performed then? Your argument is circular - for every example you or I can give, another can be given that contradicts it. The assertion that killer wolf and you are making, as Si has pointed out completely sounds false. We await the source of the quote as already asked for, if possible. For you to pick up on what AlongCameASpider27 suggested, in this way is daft. One could easily have picked "Flush The Fashion" or "Lace And Whiskey" and the reasons Si cited would still be as valid.

[A_MichaelUK]

From pitkin:
"but the tour was".

It was thirty years ago as you know and they have rarely been played since which, in case, you've forgotten is what's being discussed.

[pitkin88]

From Si:
"Have you noticed the audience losing interest during them."

There is no point in asking him because he doesn't go to the shows and he admits it, which is why so many of his opinions don't reflect the reality.

I wish I could go so I could watch for the casual fans like you do. It's probably more interesting than drum solo aka Alice rests backstage. Is it like train spotting? Do you and Si have dossiers that you share?

[pitkin88]

pitkin88 wrote:
"I am really of the belief he would need Kane back in if he were to play songs from the crap two. He knows this and that's why ( or he now thinks those two albums are cringeworthy ) non of those comeback songs are worthy of inclusion."

So aren't more songs from "Muscle Of Love" performed then? Your argument is circular - for every example you or I can give, another can be given that contradicts it. The assertion that killer wolf and you are making, as Si has pointed out completely sounds false. We await the source of the quote as already asked for, if possible. For you to pick up on what AlongCameASpider27 suggested, in this way is daft. One could easily have picked "Flush The Fashion" or "Lace And Whiskey" and the reasons Si cited would still be as valid.

Yes me and Killer Wolf are suffering from mass hysteria. I guess the great comeback equates to FTF. Bugger me!!

[ThePainAddict]

I remember the line about Alice saying his guys couldn't play the Kane material. However, I belief it is being totally misrepresented. While I don't have the source handy, I do remember Alice simply trying to praise Kane's contributions and said the guitarist at the time "couldn't play like that". However, apart from praise to Kane, it was simply a way to say that type of guitar playing was different than his guys do (i.e. it was from the guitar shredder era). This was pre-Ori, so none of his guitarists were in that vein. However, I did not take it to mean that they did not have the ability, but that it wasn't what they naturally did.
I remember Jason Hook similarly saying that he couldn't play many of the Alice songs naturally, but had to slow up his style to play the classic rock. Likewise, Alice stated that having Michael, Dennis and Neal instantly created the 70s sound on W2MN, but that doesn't mean that the current band can't play that material either.

[pitkin88]

I remember the line about Alice saying his guys couldn't play the Kane material. However, I belief it is being totally misrepresented. While I don't have the source handy, I do remember Alice simply trying to praise Kane's contributions and said the guitarist at the time "couldn't play like that". However, apart from praise to Kane, it was simply a way to say that type of guitar playing was different than his guys do (i.e. it was from the guitar shredder era). This was pre-Ori, so none of his guitarists were in that vein. However, I did not take it to mean that they did not have the ability, but that it wasn't what they naturally did.
I remember Jason Hook similarly saying that he couldn't play many of the Alice songs naturally, but had to slow up his style to play the classic rock. Likewise, Alice stated that having Michael, Dennis and Neal instantly created the 70s sound on W2MN, but that doesn't mean that the current band can't play that material either.

You must be suffering from the same illness as me and Killer Wolf. Oh well until we have proof some wont be satisfied.

[Si]

I remember the line about Alice saying his guys couldn't play the Kane material. However, I belief it is being totally misrepresented. While I don't have the source handy, I do remember Alice simply trying to praise Kane's contributions and said the guitarist at the time "couldn't play like that". However, apart from praise to Kane, it was simply a way to say that type of guitar playing was different than his guys do (i.e. it was from the guitar shredder era). This was pre-Ori, so none of his guitarists were in that vein. However, I did not take it to mean that they did not have the ability, but that it wasn't what they naturally did.
I remember Jason Hook similarly saying that he couldn't play many of the Alice songs naturally, but had to slow up his style to play the classic rock. Likewise, Alice stated that having Michael, Dennis and Neal instantly created the 70s sound on W2MN, but that doesn't mean that the current band can't play that material either.

You must be suffering from the same illness as me and Killer Wolf. Oh well until we have proof some wont be satisfied.

No, what PainAddict is saying is correct and sounds far more likely then what you were initially saying ("the songs aren`t played because they can`t play the songs").

Roxie/Damon/Steve/Kerri are not 'shredders' like Kane and listening to TF they don`t try to emulate that solo style. They can still play the song though.

If you are talking about now I would think Nita could nail the shredding with ease. She is a self-proclaimed shredder and prides herself in the speed and accuracy she can play when needed. There are examples on youtube, so now playing those songs like that isn`t an issue if Alice wanted to do so.

[AlongCameASpider27]

Well I remember back on Halloween of 2013 when I was backstage with the Coop, I had mentioned how RYFAY is my all-time favorite album, Freedom my favorite song, and the trilogy being a work of genius...I told him how much I would love to see those done live now and he said, oh yeah my current band could really do those justice, especially Orianthi! I am sure Nita could knock it out of the park as well....

[A_MichaelUK]

From pitkin88:
"I wish I could go so I could watch for the casual fans like you do."

What is wrong with that? How can you give an informed opinion about something if you don't participate or study?

> It's probably more interesting than drum solo aka Alice rests backstage.

Yes, such terrible crimes.

> Is it like train spotting? Do you and Si have dossiers that you share?

No, we like to sit around and talk about stuff we don't know anything about.

[A_MichaelUK]

From pitkin88:
"Yes me and Killer Wolf are suffering from mass hysteria. I guess the great comeback equates to FTF. Bugger me!!"

Obviously, you're being deliberately dense but I'll still spell out the point which is that, irrespective of which album they're from, most songs which are rarely performed are rarely performed because they are not particularly well - known and not for the reason you gave and even if Alice did say something that silly, I can just imagine how certain members of the current band would react (and in defence of killer wolf, he isn't saying what you're saying).