Alice's Band Mates: An Appreciation

[cooperrocks]

Not exactly true. Every tour (Ryan Roxie has said this in the past), each member of the band is told to list three songs they want to play, sort of a wish list. Nita advocated for stuff like Roses on White Lace, etc. She has stated that her favorite albums are Constrictor and Raise Your Fist and Yell and she is a big Kane fan and he has said he is a big fan of hers. Alice has also stated that before Nita was in the band, for a long time they really didn't have the shred type of guitar player to completely pull off those songs and that he liked her being in the band because they could do some of that stuff again. On a side note, when they were putting together the current show and decided to bring the snake back it was needed who suggested "Snakebite" be brought back to the show.

Oh, well. Chuck told me that they don't choose the songs. And just because Alice says something, doesn't absolutely make it true. To say that the others couldn't pull it off, is a bit ridiculous.

Not ridiculous at all. Certain players have different styles. Obviously the final decision on playlists are made by Alice and Shep Gordon probably Ezrin has input as well but the band does submit songs. I will put it another way. Before Nita came into band, how many songs from those two albums were they doing from Trash (89) until she joined the band?

[Prometheus77]

Not ridiculous at all. Certain players have different styles. Obviously the final decision on playlists are made by Alice and Shep Gordon probably Ezrin has input as well but the band does submit songs. I will put it another way. Before Nita came into band, how many songs from those two albums were they doing from Trash (89) until she joined the band?

And yet they're professionals, so style doesn't really matter and they could get it done. Not sure why the album producer would have input in what songs they play in a live show. I did hear though, that Shep decides what is played, without Alice. Although that seems a bit crazy to me too. I could imagine that Nita being in the band influenced what songs they decided to put into the show, but that those songs were played only because Nita said, let's play them, I'm not so sure. If they felt the current players couldn't do those songs and wanted to do those, they really could have gotten any player they wanted.

[Si]

Oh, well. Chuck told me that they don't choose the songs. And just because Alice says something, doesn't absolutely make it true.

They don't CHOOSE the songs, but they can always put forward suggestions. It isn't like the band never talk to Alice!

For example, some years ago, I can't remember the exact circumstances, Ryan was on a chat and Alice was wandering around behind him in the background. He mentioned something about the setlist still wasn't finalised so "we" started throwing songs at him. Ryan turned around to Alice and said something like "Hey Coop, they think we should do "..." and Alice came over and kinda said "hmmm... that's not a bad idea..."
Now... of course that doesn't mean there was any real thought into playing that track (I can`t remember... maybe "My Stars") at that point, but it shows that Alice has no problem with things being suggested.
Everyone knows the deal. You can suggest what you like but it's Alice, Bob and Shep who make the final decision based on what works.
It also works the other way. There have been times a band have been asked to learn and rehearse a song that never eventually makes it into the show. An example again being 'My Stars' which was rehearsed way back around 2003ish and the band thought it sounded amazing but it didn't make the set.

[Prometheus77]

They don't CHOOSE the songs, but they can always put forward suggestions. It isn't like the band never talk to Alice!

Duh. Obviously. But the other post made it sound like they played those songs, because Nita said to play those songs.
But still, I don't see why a producer of an album would have any input on what is played in a show. But then again, it's bad enough if, supposedly, the manager has a say in that.

[Agrophile in Texas]

Drummers?

We've talked about Ken Mary and mentioned Glen Sobel (who made Drum Magazines top 60) but who else? Neal Smith of course, that goes without saying, though he doesn't get any respect in the articles and lists I've read, he didn't even make a 'Top 50 Drummers in the HOF' list I looked over... come on man, give the platinum God his due!

Aside from those 3, I like and thought it was fitting that Johnny (Bee) Badanjek was the primary on Detroit Stories, having the local legend on that concept album was very cool. Plus, it acted as a nice reunion as he played on several tracks on Welcome To my Nightmare (the title track, Black Widow, Escape - Tony Levin joined him on bass on Welcome and Escape).

Ranked 59th in Rolling Stones Top 100, troubled Jim Gordon (who died in prison this past March) played on a few songs on Goes to Hell and Lace and Whiskey (the primary drummer on those LPs, Allan Schwartzberg, impressed as well).

Also on that RS list was Larry Mullen Jr. I liked him on Paranormal, his drumming on "Holy Water", in particular, stood out.

And that's just a handful.

[Si]

But still, I don't see why a producer of an album would have any input on what is played in a show. But then again, it's bad enough if, supposedly, the manager has a say in that.

If you are referring to Ezrin he is VERY involved in the show. He is more than just an album producer for Alice.
I have personally watched a rehearsal where Bob and Alice have been changing things: altering choreography and changing arrangements right there on stage in front of me, the band repeating parts of the show at Ezrin's direction to get them right, the day before the first show of a new tour.

Alice, Bob and Shep are a team, a partnership. All three have input into everything in terms of what we hear and what we see under the Alice Cooper name.

[Si]

Also on that RS list was Larry Mullen Jr. I liked him on Paranormal, his drumming on "Holy Water", in particular, stood out.

Really? I thought his drumming on Paranormal was pretty awful!

[Agrophile in Texas]

I won't claim to be drum expert (I can keep a beat for my demos and that's about it), but as a musician (guitar and bass) whose played with a lot of drummers over my life on stage and in the studio and have developed an ear for what works and doesn't, I have to say I didn't hear anything awful about his playing. His timing was on, the fills we're good, he's technically proficient... what did you find awful?

[Si]

I won't claim to be drum expert (I can keep a beat for my demos and that's about it), but as musician (guitar and bass) whose played with a lot of drummers over my life on stage and in the studio, I have to say I didn't hear anything awful about his playing. His timing was on, the fills we're good, he's technically proficient... what did you find awful?

I'm no drummer either (just guitar/bass), but I felt his "choices" in what to play were often poor. and didn't fit or improve the songs. Given, his style is different to most hard rock drummers, but I thought having him on the album was more "stunt casting", being a member of a mega band like U2, rather than for the benefit of the recording, especially when you have Neal or Glen sitting there who could easily IMO have done a better job.
Just my feelings about it. I'm not saying he is a bad drummer as such, just that he wasn't the best choice for an Alice Cooper hard rock album.

[cooperrocks]

They don't CHOOSE the songs, but they can always put forward suggestions. It isn't like the band never talk to Alice!

Duh. Obviously. But the other post made it sound like they played those songs, because Nita said to play those songs.
But still, I don't see why a producer of an album would have any input on what is played in a show. But then again, it's bad enough if, supposedly, the manager has a say in that.

Nope, with all due respect you ASSUMED that, but it is not what I said. I said Nita advocated for songs from Constrictor and Raise Your Fist and Yell. That doesn't mean she called the shots or made the final decision. Advocate means make a recommendation which is exactly what she did. Those are her favorite albums and a style she is very good at. When she was hired Nita said an interview that Alice told her he was glad to have a shredder in the band because, "Now, we can do some of the 80s stuff."

[Saint&Sinner]

Oh, well. Chuck told me that they don't choose the songs. And just because Alice says something, doesn't absolutely make it true. To say that the others couldn't pull it off, is a bit ridiculous.

Its not ridiculous at all, certain players are good at certain things. All three guitarists are talented but all in different areas. Ryan and tommy are not fast players.
Alices band post 2000 until orianthi came in wasnt suited to the 1980s style of guitaring. It was way too focused on the garage rock style. Orianthi is more blues based but her skills stretched into the shred/neo classical style which allowed alice to start playing more of that material. Nita is a big fan of the 80s style so she lobbied for more of that material and i presume alice saw more appreciation for the 80s stuff than what the snooty musical press lead people to believe.

I will never understand the love in for Glen Sobel, but each to their own. Another good drummer for alice, besides my fave Ken Mary was jimmy Degrasso. He was a superb drummer who had really great control, interesting fills and really good, intricate pedal work. John Mover was great on trashes the world and was much better than eric singer who replaced him.
Pentti "Whitey" Glan was also good. Not very flash and a bit more of a swing to his style but really delivered when he wanted to. His work on stuff like wish you were here is stunning.
Neal smith was great and has a unique feel to his drumming that is hard to mistake. B$B is still the bench mark for any drum riff. Even when he drums on the newer albums he stands out a mile (in a good way) He was a legend and id think if he remained either with alice or active in music then i think his skill would have grown even more. I like him allot and its a crying shame he didnt drum on constrictor. (can you imagine!!?!?!)

[Agrophile in Texas]

Yeah, I remember producers I worked with mulling over which players to bring in, who was the best fit for the style of music being recorded. "I have so and so, who's good with this kind of lead guitar, or whatsit, who's better with that..." type of thing. So, it's a factor. Though I always wondered what it would have sounded like if he chose the other guy (I mean, both were talented, it's not like you were going to get bad playing).

And Neal, restating, I can play a basic, steady beat, but I had one other thing that was really cool, and I thought, really unique, until I realized I was imitating Neal on "You Drive Me Nervous" (and later learned the technique had a name, so darn it, I didn't invent a new drum style - LMOA) so he left an impression.

I simply love him on Return of the Spiders, or B$B which is sublime, you hear that, and it just puts you in a mood, you wanna rock in your seat, or play air drums. It's infectious. And you get him and Dennis going on something and it's the same, just heart pumping, the live stuff on the recent Killer/Schools Out remasters for example, wow. They're a dream-team.

[cooperrocks]

Speaking of the drums regarding the Constrictor album. On an interview on Sirius XM last year, Kane Roberts mentioned that there was some talk of bringing Anton Fig in to play drums for that album as well but due to time (maybe budget too), they went with drum machines on that album and then of course real drums on Raise Your Fist and Yell. I like the Constrictor album but always wondered how different that album would sound with actual drums. I would love to hear it remastered and remixed with actual drums.

[alicefannor]

I’m thrilled about Nita in the band, but I admit that I might be in love with her . My final say is that I find everything about her stunning!

Aside from the obvious original band preferences, I think Damon Johnson was a terrific addition to the band. His post Alice career is a testament to his talents!

[rodentdog]

How is this for nitpicking? I like glen on drums live but on the last tour he did'nt play the short drum fill before the second verse on Raped and freezing every time I saw them which was 5. And everytime it aggravated me ! He obviously had'nt listened to BDB a million times.
And I guess while I'm being aggravated over drummers I will throw in as number one Nita's drummer, boyfriend, fiance. Always too high in the mix and he's using drum triggers out the wahzoo. Might as well throw in his cymbals sound like trashcan lids also.

[revinkevin]

I’m no drummer either but there is a very noticeable difference on W2MN between Mullins and Neal. To my ears Neal is much more of a rock drummer and a harder hitter on the drums. Sort of like comparing Buddy Rich to Sandy Nelson. Buddy was more big band sound and Sandy was a rocker. Comes down to personal preference. I’ll take Sandy and Neal.

[Si]

I’m no drummer either but there is a very noticeable difference on W2MN between Mullins and Neal.

You mean Paranormal.

[Agrophile in Texas]

Revisited Paranormal, to really focus on the drums and Mullen's play, and yeah, still think he's fantastic (Paranoiac Personality was impressive, don't know how you can hit the drums any harder than that). Saying that, Neal's the ultimate in my Alice world, so I'd have had zero complaints had he been the primary. I mean, the whole band slays on Rats. Enjoyed the drumming in total.

But my Alice day wasn't done..

Aside from the obvious original band preferences, I think Damon Johnson was a terrific addition to the band. His post Alice career is a testament to his talents!

You're mentioning him inspired me to watch "Live at Montreux".

I love Dirty Diamonds, but I felt it needed a little more pop on the drums -production wise- in spots, like for the title song... and boy, do they pop in concert on that number. And I love the lead guitar bits as well, just wish the editor had allowed us more time to watch them play - all the flash cuts, yikes.

Still great to see and hear Damon, and the others too.

[alicefannor]

I’m no drummer either but there is a very noticeable difference on W2MN between Mullins and Neal.

You mean Paranormal.

…and Mullen.
Jr.

[alicefannor]

Revisited Paranormal, to really focus on the drums and Mullen's play, and yeah, still think he's fantastic (Paranoiac Personality was impressive, don't know how you can hit the drums any harder than that). Saying that, Neal's the ultimate in my Alice world, so I'd have had zero complaints had he been the primary. I mean, the whole band slays on Rats. Enjoyed the drumming in total.

But my Alice day wasn't done..

Aside from the obvious original band preferences, I think Damon Johnson was a terrific addition to the band. His post Alice career is a testament to his talents!

You're mentioning him inspired me to watch "Live at Montreux".

I love Dirty Diamonds, but I felt it needed a little more pop on the drums -production wise- in spots, like for the title song... and boy, do they pop in concert on that number. And I love the lead guitar bits as well, just wish the editor had allowed us more time to watch them play - all the flash cuts, yikes.

Still great to see and hear Damon, and the others too.

Montreux 2005 is perhaps my favorite live mix on any of the official releases.
Jimmy DeGrasso was mentioned above. Great drummer, but the drum sound on Theatre of Death is not very good imo….

Eric Singer is still my favorite Alice post-classic line up drummer.
Remember being very disappointed when he didn’t appear on Dirty Diamonds (though he does appear on the photo in the cd booklet )
Perhaps it was cause he was busy with kiss during 2004?
Was there ever an official reason ?