Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

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While Heaven Wept
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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by While Heaven Wept » Wed Aug 30, 2017 1:20 pm

I hate identity politics. GAG is just a decent song with a nice, harmless lyric. If he had done this song 20 years ago no-one would bat an eye lid, but now the world has become fickle and emotional so their brains can't cope with it.

It's a song, nothing more. Chill out.

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by dadascot » Wed Aug 30, 2017 9:20 pm

While Heaven Wept wrote:I hate identity politics. GAG is just a decent song with a nice, harmless lyric. If he had done this song 20 years ago no-one would bat an eye lid, but now the world has become fickle and emotional so their brains can't cope with it.

It's a song, nothing more. Chill out.
Spot on!

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by Swinger » Wed Aug 30, 2017 11:06 pm

Like I said before, I don't mind the song. I'm not offended by it. I'm not gonna stop listening to Alice or stop liking Alice. GAG itself is harmless and fun. It might be a tad ignorant but it isn't mean-spirited. And yeah, just looking at the lyrics it's kinda empowering.

But it's not just a song. It's a song that exists in a context, in a culture where basically every sitcom in the last 20 years one time or another has done the joke "Look a transperson - isn't that funny?" . If Alice calls the song satire then I have to ask what is it satirizing? That transpeople exist?
And I'm not saying you can't make jokes about transpeople, Eddie Izzard claiming he would be a rubbish superhero because by the time he'd changed into his superhero costume the people he'd tried to save would have died is hilarious, but the mere existance of transpeople in and of itself isn't a joke.

Like mr.barlow said, I don't get upset or offended if someone jokes about white people or about swedish people but I have on the other hand never had people laugh in my face or harass me in the street because I'm swedish or white but people have done so over the fact that I'm trans.

But like I said the song on it's own isn't a problem. The song, combined with Alices comments about it, combined with years and years of transpeople being the butt of the joke - that's problematic. It doesn't stop me from listening to it or enjoying it, but it made me stop and think "What is he trying to say? Is he mocking or just poking lighthearted fun?".

And I don't want to talk politics, I just want to be able to look at a song in a bigger context than just the music and lyrics itself.

Oh and Alice talking about the absurdity Caitlyn Jenner coming out - if you told a teenager buying Killer for the first time in '71 that in 40 years time Alice would be well known for his christianity and that he'd written a book with his favourite golf tips, they would think you were crazy as well. Or if you told someone in the 50s that "You know Vince, the scrawny little kid who's the son of the preacher? In 20 years he'll change his name to Alice, wear womens clothes and sing about having sex with corpses." then they'd never believe you either.
Anything can be absurd if you look at it in a certain way.

And Alice using Caitlyn Jenners old name? That's funny coming from someone who's talked about that it doesn't make sense to call him Vincent anymore since his name is Alice.
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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by Rhapsody of Fire » Wed Aug 30, 2017 11:37 pm

mr.barlow wrote:If you are comfortable with who you are then who the hell cares what anyone thinks. The problem in today's society is that it has lost it's sense of humor. Everyone takes themselves too seriously and is so easily offended or disrespected.

I'm a middle aged white guy. Do I give a rat's ass when black rappers call me "cracker" and other derogatory terms? No--I can care less--in fact I find it funny!

I'm Polish too---do I get offended at every Polish joke? No--I laugh right along!

My point is--relax--just be who you are. Comedy is comedy--it's not meant to be taken to heart. I'm afraid now we are witnessing the beginning of the death of humor. Everyone is too sensitive--or self-important--to understand that a joke is a joke--and nothing more!
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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by Si » Thu Aug 31, 2017 12:50 am

Swinger wrote: And Alice using Caitlyn Jenners old name? That's funny coming from someone who's talked about that it doesn't make sense to call him Vincent anymore since his name is Alice.
I should thing that is simply down to the fact he knew Jenner and played golf with him when he was 'Bruce' and hasn`t met him in a long time, so he's still Bruce to him. I wouldn`t read anything into that at all. It's unlikely he's every really thought about it to any great degree until he was asked the question.

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by mr.barlow » Thu Aug 31, 2017 3:22 am

Rhapsody of Fire wrote:
mr.barlow wrote:If you are comfortable with who you are then who the hell cares what anyone thinks. The problem in today's society is that it has lost it's sense of humor. Everyone takes themselves too seriously and is so easily offended or disrespected.

I'm a middle aged white guy. Do I give a rat's ass when black rappers call me "cracker" and other derogatory terms? No--I can care less--in fact I find it funny!

I'm Polish too---do I get offended at every Polish joke? No--I laugh right along!

My point is--relax--just be who you are. Comedy is comedy--it's not meant to be taken to heart. I'm afraid now we are witnessing the beginning of the death of humor. Everyone is too sensitive--or self-important--to understand that a joke is a joke--and nothing more!
This is you. If someone call me a stupid frog because I'm French, joke or not, I swear that I will never talk to that person again, it's a thing called ''Pride''.

Poor baby!

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by mr.barlow » Thu Aug 31, 2017 3:31 am

Swinger wrote:Like I said before, I don't mind the song. I'm not offended by it. I'm not gonna stop listening to Alice or stop liking Alice. GAG itself is harmless and fun. It might be a tad ignorant but it isn't mean-spirited. And yeah, just looking at the lyrics it's kinda empowering.

But it's not just a song. It's a song that exists in a context, in a culture where basically every sitcom in the last 20 years one time or another has done the joke "Look a transperson - isn't that funny?" . If Alice calls the song satire then I have to ask what is it satirizing? That transpeople exist?
And I'm not saying you can't make jokes about transpeople, Eddie Izzard claiming he would be a rubbish superhero because by the time he'd changed into his superhero costume the people he'd tried to save would have died is hilarious, but the mere existance of transpeople in and of itself isn't a joke.

Like mr.barlow said, I don't get upset or offended if someone jokes about white people or about swedish people but I have on the other hand never had people laugh in my face or harass me in the street because I'm swedish or white but people have done so over the fact that I'm trans.

But like I said the song on it's own isn't a problem. The song, combined with Alices comments about it, combined with years and years of transpeople being the butt of the joke - that's problematic. It doesn't stop me from listening to it or enjoying it, but it made me stop and think "What is he trying to say? Is he mocking or just poking lighthearted fun?".

And I don't want to talk politics, I just want to be able to look at a song in a bigger context than just the music and lyrics itself.

Oh and Alice talking about the absurdity Caitlyn Jenner coming out - if you told a teenager buying Killer for the first time in '71 that in 40 years time Alice would be well known for his christianity and that he'd written a book with his favourite golf tips, they would think you were crazy as well. Or if you told someone in the 50s that "You know Vince, the scrawny little kid who's the son of the preacher? In 20 years he'll change his name to Alice, wear womens clothes and sing about having sex with corpses." then they'd never believe you either.
Anything can be absurd if you look at it in a certain way.

And Alice using Caitlyn Jenners old name? That's funny coming from someone who's talked about that it doesn't make sense to call him Vincent anymore since his name is Alice.
To most men--seeing another man in a dress and make-up is either funny, ridiculous or offensive. I'm not saying it's okay for them to feel that way, but that's just the way it is. Most males are wired as male as females are wired as female. It's just the way it is.

Should you be mocked, discriminated, ridiculed, etc.? Absolutley not! I am straight but have been around gay people (male and female) for most of my adult life as most of the women I have been with over the years have been involved in the theatre or the arts and they have had a lot of gay friends. Nearly every single gay or lesbian person I have ever know were very comfortable in their own skin and had incredible humor.

Also, most of the gay people who I am friendly with today are HUGE Trump supporters. So go figure that one!

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by While Heaven Wept » Thu Aug 31, 2017 11:16 am

I just think people like talking about themselves too much. The reality is, no-one cares about your sexuality or gender. It's really boring. People need to lighten up and stop being a victim.

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by NotSoPerfect » Thu Aug 31, 2017 10:44 pm

While Heaven Wept wrote:I just think people like talking about themselves too much. The reality is, no-one cares about your sexuality or gender. It's really boring. People need to lighten up and stop being a victim.
I tried to figure out about 15 ways to word a response without getting way too political, and I pretty much couldn't.

Short of it basically is...if you've followed the news any time recently, I think it's pretty evident that entirely too many people DO care about the sexuality and gender of others. To think otherwise is to not be paying attention.
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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by pitkin88 » Thu Aug 31, 2017 11:18 pm

NotSoPerfect wrote:
While Heaven Wept wrote:I just think people like talking about themselves too much. The reality is, no-one cares about your sexuality or gender. It's really boring. People need to lighten up and stop being a victim.
I tried to figure out about 15 ways to word a response without getting way too political, and I pretty much couldn't.

Short of it basically is...if you've followed the news any time recently, I think it's pretty evident that entirely too many people DO care about the sexuality and gender of others. To think otherwise is to not be paying attention.

Yes agreed. His post was pretty stupid and insensitive.

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by padre_sliprat » Fri Sep 01, 2017 7:31 am

If someone calls me a bad name, I agree and buy 'em a beer. That usually puts paid to the problem. I win.
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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by Si » Fri Sep 01, 2017 7:35 am

padre_sliprat wrote:If someone calls me a bad name, I agree and buy 'em a beer. That usually puts paid to the problem. I win.
Not sure about that with the prices of beers nowadays... seems to me you're out one beer and the other guy got a free drink for being insulting ;)

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by dadascot » Fri Sep 01, 2017 11:25 am

Anyway I think the new album is really good, so there!

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by While Heaven Wept » Fri Sep 01, 2017 1:12 pm

NotSoPerfect wrote:
While Heaven Wept wrote:I just think people like talking about themselves too much. The reality is, no-one cares about your sexuality or gender. It's really boring. People need to lighten up and stop being a victim.
I tried to figure out about 15 ways to word a response without getting way too political, and I pretty much couldn't.

Short of it basically is...if you've followed the news any time recently, I think it's pretty evident that entirely too many people DO care about the sexuality and gender of others. To think otherwise is to not be paying attention.
I disagree. The media tries to make out that the world is full of racists, bigots and transphobes. Of-course, there will also be a minority of people like that, but I sincerely believe that the vast majority of people simply don't care.

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by guttertrash » Fri Sep 01, 2017 2:44 pm

I don't think the media is trying to make it look like everybody is racist, bigoted, or transphobic. I think when you have politicians that are continuously speaking out against and making it extremely hard for these people to be treated equally, and you have supremacists of any kind shouting in agreeance, that it should be viewed as a major issue.

It doesn't mean that the majority of people, and it is probably not even 10% of the population that feels this way, but when the system is run by less than 1% of the population and many of them have these ideologies and are continuously trying to legislate people's lifestyles, it should be talked about by the media until that kind of pathetic, over-reaching style of governing the people is eradicated.

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by dadascot » Wed Sep 06, 2017 9:10 am

guttertrash wrote:I don't think the media is trying to make it look like everybody is racist, bigoted, or transphobic. I think when you have politicians that are continuously speaking out against and making it extremely hard for these people to be treated equally, and you have supremacists of any kind shouting in agreeance, that it should be viewed as a major issue.

It doesn't mean that the majority of people, and it is probably not even 10% of the population that feels this way, but when the system is run by less than 1% of the population and many of them have these ideologies and are continuously trying to legislate people's lifestyles, it should be talked about by the media until that kind of pathetic, over-reaching style of governing the people is eradicated.
Absolutely spot on. Well said!

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by padre_sliprat » Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:12 am

Si wrote:
padre_sliprat wrote:If someone calls me a bad name, I agree and buy 'em a beer. That usually puts paid to the problem. I win.
Not sure about that with the prices of beers nowadays... seems to me you're out one beer and the other guy got a free drink for being insulting ;)
You're onto my scheme. He will keep insulting me for the free beer, and before long he's graduated to whiskey. He becomes an alcoholic, I quit buying. He loses his job, house, family, dignity, health...perfect.
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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by grim fact » Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:51 am

A few decent tracks.

Overall not that exciting, nor interesting.

Ready for another release.

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by I'm Pain » Sat Sep 16, 2017 11:18 am

Song was the " Coolest Song of the week" on Little Steven's Underground Garage last week. Received a fair amount of airplay.

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Re: Thoughts On And Ranking The New Album

Post by del » Sat Sep 16, 2017 10:49 pm

Listened to the album in full twice today as I was driving. Delighted to say it's still growing on me. Fireball and Paranormal right under the skin now as classics for me. A very solid 8/10 now.

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