Paris Special 82

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Paris Special 82

Post by pitkin88 » Sun Mar 31, 2019 4:39 am

Just been watching this again and it is really fantastic. Yes the visuals are dated but it is so much fun. Alice was really taking chances with the change of look and the new direction musically.

The seven or so re recorded songs are terrific. The intro to Schools Out adds a whole new dimension to the song and then that band play it like a machine gun fire. Even Only Women Bleed which should sound out of place in this set sounds eerie and works completely. 18 has a great vocal from Alice and credit surely goes to whoever rearranged these songs. Guessing Erik Scott.

Alice moves around on stage like a maniac and that band look just nuts. I know it will never happen but that album could get a deluxe treatment as there is plenty of great quality stuff out there. The Tom Synder performances are great too.

Anyone else think the blackout years would make a great box set?

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by Model Citizen » Sun Mar 31, 2019 6:57 am

Well, as evidenced by my avatar, the blackout years hold a special place for me. I love those unusual records. Especially FTF and SF. I would love to see deluxe reissues or a box set with some bonus material. I think that era is unjustly maligned.

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by VinceRaven » Sun Mar 31, 2019 8:26 am

I think, generally speaking, you have to have been a certain age when these records came out to be a big fan of them. I'd certainly include myself in that category. A box set would be fantastic and Erik Scott would be the ideal person to be at the helm of it all. I can't see it ever happening though.

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by Railwayman » Sun Mar 31, 2019 11:27 am

Will always have a soft spot for this era as the 'Special Forces' tour was the first tour I saw Alice live in concert. Looking at this now, Alice was in a shocking state but I remember enjoying seeing him at last having followed him for 10 years after seeing him on Top Of The Pops doing School's Out. Having said that, the Nightmare Returns tour / show really really blew me away in comparison.

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by padre_sliprat » Sun Mar 31, 2019 12:32 pm

pitkin88 wrote:
Sun Mar 31, 2019 4:39 am
Anyone else think the blackout years would make a great box set?
Got those four vinyls in shrink wrap for almost nothing in one transaction last year. The oddball in the bunch is SF with a gold stamped 'not for sale - radio station promo only' thing on the cover. That one did NOT come in shrink wrap. All were unplayed and in mint condition. They were just sitting there in a used record shop. The guy said they just came in so I snapped them up. First and only time I was ever in that shop. Yes, I'd say it'd make a cool boxset
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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by pitkin88 » Mon Apr 01, 2019 2:29 am

The one odd moment of the special is the playing of You and Me over the opening. Thankfully it's brief!

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by del » Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:55 am

Railwayman wrote:
Sun Mar 31, 2019 11:27 am
Will always have a soft spot for this era as the 'Special Forces' tour was the first tour I saw Alice live in concert. Looking at this now, Alice was in a shocking state but I remember enjoying seeing him at last having followed him for 10 years after seeing him on Top Of The Pops doing School's Out. Having said that, the Nightmare Returns tour / show really really blew me away in comparison.
My thoughts too.

Also remember thinking though that this period felt very much like various different attempts to be relevant to a new audience at a time where everything seemed to have changed and moved on following punk.

It didn't seem to be working at all though and at the time I genuinely didn't know how he would follow up Da Da. To me it felt like the end of the career was coming. While I like the albums the period therefore always feels a little sad for me.

A box set would be good as this is certainly the most distinctively different phase of the career. If anyone could remember any more about it it would be great to put the full story of the period and the albums together as part of the package. We've got some perspectives from the period but it would be great if they were brought together and anything else available was added in.

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by Si » Mon Apr 01, 2019 8:10 am

It could be easier to actually do a complete overview of the period now that Alice is being more honest about what was going on (ie the drugs). But I think it would be a hard sell for any but the most dedicated fans and therefore there would be little money in the project to cover the costs of producing it.

I also question how much additional material would actually exists for bonuses. There's a fair bit of video from TV etc (which would possibly be expensive to use), the Paris special (which is now out as a bootleg so less appealing unless they can get the original tapes). A live show could probably be included (Probably El Paso which we all have), but how many studio outtakes etc would there be that haven`t already been released?

This is a good example of how these "grey area" bootlegs on Amazon etc reduce the chance of us getting anything like this released officially. They cut into any financial returns that are needed to pay for it, as an official release would need to pay all the royalties and for the rights to use stuff, when the bootlegs don't bother with such things and hence make 100% profit.

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by padre_sliprat » Mon Apr 01, 2019 4:08 pm

Si wrote:
Mon Apr 01, 2019 8:10 am
This is a good example of how these "grey area" bootlegs on Amazon etc reduce the chance of us getting anything like this released officially. They cut into any financial returns that are needed to pay for it, as an official release would need to pay all the royalties and for the rights to use stuff, when the bootlegs don't bother with such things and hence make 100% profit.
It's a sad state of affairs when an artist could conceivably find the need to bootleg his own stuff to make a buck. Gee, I hope I didn't just give anybody any ideas.
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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by Si » Mon Apr 01, 2019 5:39 pm

padre_sliprat wrote:
Mon Apr 01, 2019 4:08 pm
It's a sad state of affairs when an artist could conceivably find the need to bootleg his own stuff to make a buck. Gee, I hope I didn't just give anybody any ideas.
Problem is if the artist got caught the repercussions could be huge, in terms of getting to do anything afterwards. They would be burning publishers, record companies, musicians and all sorts of other interested parties.
Can't exactly go back to them afterwards and ask to use things for new projects.

The makers of these bootlegs face little more then a fine if anything at all, and they know it.

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by padre_sliprat » Tue Apr 02, 2019 3:04 am

Si wrote:
Mon Apr 01, 2019 5:39 pm
Problem is if the artist got caught the repercussions could be huge, in terms of getting to do anything afterwards. They would be burning publishers, record companies, musicians and all sorts of other interested parties.
Can't exactly go back to them afterwards and ask to use things for new projects.

The makers of these bootlegs face little more then a fine if anything at all, and they know it.
I was being facetious, but you're right. Criminals have free reign while the artists are bound and gagged.
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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by pitkin88 » Tue Apr 02, 2019 4:53 am

On the other hand the artists have had ample time to put stuff out and never bothered. As fans we owe the bootleggers, the early ones at least, a hell of a lot for preserving shows and live recordings.

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by pitkin88 » Tue Apr 02, 2019 5:01 am

As for what exists besides El Paso we have the Radio Clyde partial broadcast that exists. I'm guessing the full show was recorded. Then there's the Special Forces average with some different mixes. Tom Snyder show might have been kept and would surely be an upgrade in sound. A blackout box or digital download would be great. Without going into depth about Alice's condition Id love to hear from the musicians about the sessions.

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by pitkin88 » Tue Apr 02, 2019 5:02 am

Predictive speller changed Acetate to average. Special Forces acetate.

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by pitkin88 » Tue Apr 02, 2019 5:03 am

Side bar, has RTB every spoken about FTF?

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by Si » Tue Apr 02, 2019 7:32 am

pitkin88 wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 5:03 am
Side bar, has RTB every spoken about FTF?
I've never really looked tbh, but I think I recall the odd one liner in interviews here and there. Nothing in depth though.
Would be happy to be proved wrong.

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by VinceRaven » Tue Apr 02, 2019 3:41 pm

Si wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 7:32 am
pitkin88 wrote:
Tue Apr 02, 2019 5:03 am
Side bar, has RTB every spoken about FTF?
I've never really looked tbh, but I think I recall the odd one liner in interviews here and there. Nothing in depth though.
Would be happy to be proved wrong.
Despite the vast number of years he's worked and the number of bands he's produced, almost everything I've ever seen him talk about or get asked about is his work with Queen. And there's probably quite a bit covering his work with The Cars as well.

Not so long ago I stumbled upon a 1982 audio interview with him on youtube. The way he's speaking, it's a fair bet he had one or two aperitifs before and/or during the Q&A. I skipped through it assuming that there was a high chance Flush The Fashion and Alice would get some kind of mention due to the short space of time between that album being produced and the interview, which was no less than 30 minutes long, but there was nothing.

Only point of note (unless I missed something) was Baker saying he was really struggling during 1980 and '81 so desperately needed a break then. I can't remember if he specified why, though I suspect he claimed it was overwork. Perhaps he's yet another from that time with a not-so-good recollection of what went on and a certain unwillingness to relive those days?

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by Rob » Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:36 pm

With regards to the Radio Clyde recording , I remember back when the station was sold Record Collector magazine reporting that somebody had obtained all the live recordings with looking to releasing them at some point and the Alice Glasgow show was mentioned although I cannot recall who it was :/
It must be true A_Michael said so

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by pitkin88 » Tue Apr 02, 2019 11:09 pm

Had no idea the station had been sold. Any idea what other bands they recorded Rob?

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Re: Paris Special 82

Post by Toronto Bob » Wed Apr 03, 2019 4:27 pm

I see it a bit different. The bootleggers, while doing a sloppy job for the most part, are the only reason we have the material. If someone from the Alice camp actually kept good audio records, they could easily package and release this material and most all who are interested, would buy an Alice Archival Series.

Everyone who has the El Paso show actually have about 1/2 the El Paso show. Anyone who has the Glasgow show, doesn't have a complete Glasgow show nor do they has a master/1st gen copy. Many improvements could be made on most of those grey market broadcast releases IF someone had cared enough to catalog it. Sorry if that sounds harsh but you should consider it - those bootlegs have done more to document the live history of Alice than any "official" source.

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