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PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 9:11 pm 
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I am not sure how many of you overseas know who Eddie Trunk is, but he is pretty well known in the United States. He gets criticized a lot for name dropping, etc. but no one stands up for hard rock and metal music more than he does and he is friends with Alice.

I was flipping channels last night on Sirius Xm radio and they were talking a little bit about Alice's new album. Eddie said he had not heard it yet but planned to. He then talked about how record labels used to send out promo copies, etc. to radio. He said he seldom receives any of that anymore. He did say he does go out and buy CD's on his own but since he has several radio shows, he would play bands with new albums more often if the labels would send him something to play.

I am not here to debate Eddie Trunk if you are fan or not, but I do think what he said has some value.The new Alice seems to have gotten good promotion online but outside of Alice's "Nights With Alice Cooper" as far as I know, it hasn't gotten any radio airplay at all. On a show like Trunk's and a few other specialty shows, wouldn't it make sense for record labels to still send out a few tracks. That is the only place an older artist might have a chance of getting a little bit of radio airplay.

Trunk also commented that it blew his mind that a band would release a new album and then a week or two later it is forgotten and many times they will only play 1 or no new songs off a new album. I couldn't disagree with this. I get the fans want to hear the well-known stuff but when you have a new album, don't you want to try and push it, the best you can?


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 10:23 pm 
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Billion Dollar Baby
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Rock music is not the focus of labels, and the rock bands that do matter to labels get a single out there usually a month or so before releases like always. Promos were a great thing, but the labels and radio have such a strict playlist these days that they are not going to waste money on sending things out that will never be played on major radio. It's a pretty sad situation, but the money is going to urban/hip-hop music and pop, and it is the way the industry works now.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 10:51 pm 
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guttertrash wrote:
Rock music is not the focus of labels, and the rock bands that do matter to labels get a single out there usually a month or so before releases like always. Promos were a great thing, but the labels and radio have such a strict playlist these days that they are not going to waste money on sending things out that will never be played on major radio. It's a pretty sad situation, but the money is going to urban/hip-hop music and pop, and it is the way the industry works now.




Does it need to be a physical copy? A download wouldn't cost amything or next to nothing.










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PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 11:23 pm 
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Billion Dollar Baby
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That's a good question. I would imagine it doesn't have to be a physical copy. I just thought he made a decent point. Trunk and a few others are about the only place a veteran hard rock artist has a chance at getting any kind of airplay and he said if he had a copy he would play something off the album (yes I know he could go out and buy a copy like the rest of us, lol). I just think if there is a specialty show out there that plays hard rock, you have to send them a song or two and hope for a couple of plays.


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 29, 2017 11:55 pm 
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pitkin88 wrote:
guttertrash wrote:
Rock music is not the focus of labels, and the rock bands that do matter to labels get a single out there usually a month or so before releases like always. Promos were a great thing, but the labels and radio have such a strict playlist these days that they are not going to waste money on sending things out that will never be played on major radio. It's a pretty sad situation, but the money is going to urban/hip-hop music and pop, and it is the way the industry works now.




Does it need to be a physical copy? A download wouldn't cost amything or next to nothing.


I was under the impression that that's how it's done now by most labels. I could be wrong. I think all promos/pre-releases are done via download now. I'm guessing there are still some physical copies made but nowhere in the numbers of the past. Also, I think radio is given all proper releases via download. I think very few big stations actually spin records/cds anymore as it's all digital. The disc jockies in some cases just fill in the space between songs given to them by their masters, and some of that is recorded in advance and the whole thing is just a computer running what you hear on the air.

Given the positive reception of the album, the great reviews and the possibility that Genuine American Girl could likely break in some fashion, I'm hoping Shep & Company ramp up the promotional push--especially on social media.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:06 am 
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For the record Planet Rock have been playing PP quite a lot, based on the fact I've heard it several times in the maybe 20-30 mins I listen to each night before falling asleep.
I'm almost sure PP was available to Trunk to play and has been for a few weeks. I can`t see why it wouldn`t be. Remember that the stations that air NWAC add the songs in themselves (I believe. They get the Alice links via download with a list of songs, including gaps for their own choices in the blocks of three that are played), so they must all have had copies of the relevent songs for them to be able to do that as well.
I think Trunk may have missed the memo or something this time, not that he doesn't have a valid point generally.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 12:08 am 
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Billion Dollar Baby
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I think Eddie Trunk and others should speak with the labels personally, because they are the people that can prove their worth if the labels care at all. I just think most labels are not worried about what Eddie Trunk's podcast or whatever can attract. It could be shortsighted, or maybe they have come to a conclusion that those who listen to such shows are already in the demographic that will be reached by other promotional tools. Fewer and fewer people care about rock n' roll, and who knows what the numbers are listening to Eddie or whoever these days. There is so much behind the scenes that makes it hard to know exactly why these choices are made, but yes, you would assume that when it is cheap or free promotion that it would be worth doing.

I'd love for Alice to have a hit even if I don't personally care for it. The guy is a hard worker and great when surrounded by the right pieces. I just do not think the pieces (namely Ezrin) make Alice great.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 1:01 am 
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I understand that music is subjective, but Bob Ezrin is one of the main reasons that anyone ever heard of Alice Cooper. Ask Alice or any of the original band members. Ezrin helped them achieve massive fame. Ezrin heled shape the albums and songs into what are now perceived as legendary!

I was not really expecting much with this new album and I will admit I am floored about what I am hearing. Sure, there are a few missteps, but this is Alice's best album since Brutal Planet and contains a few songs that are going to end up being fan favorites. Also, Genuine American Girl has to the potential to break (at least by today's standards). I'm hoping they steer the ship the right way and get this song the attention it deserves and Alice could end up having a hit! If this song were released in the 1970s or 1980s it would have been a Top 10 single.

Ezrin had had some missteps in his long career, as have every great producer, but there is no doubt that it was his genius that helped Alice become who he is today! Without Ezrin--Alice Cooper the band and the singer would have disappeared before anyone even knew their 18th century witch inspired name.

Well, maybe Jimi, Janis, Elvis, Mojo Risin. Mojo Nixon, Richard Nixon and a few others would have known them.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 1:33 am 
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Billion Dollar Baby
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This album has ideas that could have been great. Overall, it sounds like a turd. Ezrin's production is awful. I don't care what he did in the 70s. The production sinks what is in front. There is so much compression, vocal effects, and crap that it sounds like Ezrin thought he was making a Panic At The Disco pop/punk album or 30 Minutes To Mars since he did actually produce their crap album. You all might be fine with an album that sounds like Alice singing other band's songs. I'm not. It is not creative, and the few moments that could be brilliant are mired by bad production ideas that kill any chance of swagger. Dirty Diamonds production would have fit most of these songs better, and themusic could have breathed. This is pompously overproduced when there needed to be nothing of the such.

On a note related to promotion and distribution, I have been out and about today looking around and not neither of the record stores I have been to have it. There is one other that I will look tomorrow. Neither Best Buy had it either, and a friend called a couple Walmart stores, snd they didn't have it.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 2:01 am 
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Again, music is subjective and you are entitled to your tastes and opinions, but it seems that overall a good portion of his fan base and critics are happy with the album.

Most on this forum know I am a very critical bastard, and to be honest I wasn't expecting much with this album. I am thrilled to have an Alice album I can enjoy. W2MN was not a bad album but I was turned off by both making it a sequel and the just God awful cover. I found nothing wrong with Ezrin's production. Is it perfect--no, is it good--yes!

I think that Alice is happy and comfortable working with Ezrin. He is 69 years old and the last thing he is thinking about is having a smash hit album. I'm sure he has no inclination to work with Rick Rubin, Reuben Sandwich, or any hot hipster producer out there today. You may not like it or feel he is selling himself short, but at this time in his career Alice is content with working with a trusted friend. I don't blame him one bit.

We all know Alice does not need to be to making new albums, or even touring for that matter. He does it because he loves it. He likes Bob and I'm sure the whole writing and recording was a very casual thing. Alice at this point does not need to be "pushed" or "tested". Those days are over. He is out to enjoy himself and working with people who he enjoys being with.

If I were Alice at this point in my career, and with 40 million in the bank, I wouldn't give a damn if Ezrin "brickwalled" the album, compressed it, or even added a hidden track of a hip hop version of "No More Love At Your Convenience" at the end of it. It's about enjoying the end of a stellar career.

They turned in a great album that sounds like they enjoyed writing and recording. I raise a toast to Ezrin's brickwall and a tip of my hat to his compression. As personally, I don't care! Good job guys--thanks for giving us an enjoyable album!


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 2:24 am 
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A lot of members of this forum came to love Alice Cooper by hearing him on AM radio or on cheap stereo systems bought at Sears. Alice sounded great on a cheap radio or an expensive system--it was about the songs.

Long before hipsters and audiophiles came about telling us all about the minute details of production there were millions of us enjoying the grittiness of rock and roll. Rock n roll was not meant to be pretty.

With that being said, I find nothing wrong with getting the best sound from any particular album. But I'm not one to obsess about hearing the dropping of a drum stick, or some obscure effect added to a guitar.

For the most part--no one really cares. An album either sounds good or it sounds shitty, but to the untrained ear--especially the ears of 99% of listeners of rock n roll or pop--they haven't a clue. Elvis sold millions of records--more than most of the legendary bands who turned in some of the most well produced albums of all-time. Listen to the production of any Elvis song. It ain't that great! The thing is NO ONE CARES! I would bet that "Jailhouse Rock" out sells any masterfully produced Pink Floyd song still today!

I'll let the audiophiles sit and analyze every little nuance and obsess about brickwalls, compression and the like. Me, I'm just going to enjoy the songs.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 5:13 am 
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Billion Dollar Baby
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My whole issue is that this album is trying to sound pristine, but it is not. The guitars have no tone or character. They are razor thin and compressed to hell. They lose their audibility at times. Ever Fallen In Love turns into a rumble with no definition at all at times. Why does Alice need vocal effects on Fireball and You And All Your Friends? It's wonky. The album is so overproduced that it kills any edge that it would have. And Ezrin himself pulled a hipster in for god knows what reason. Parker Gispert is in an indie-rock band called The Whigs that is quite well known in the southeast U.S. He has always had incredible tone, but Ezrin finds a way to completely ruin it. I just don't get the reasoning behind bringing somebody like that in though when Ryan Roxie has written some incredible songs, and many that are classic Coop. I don't get the disconnect between the studio and the touring band at all. Between the ACG members and the band members, I guarantee they could make a better album than this, and it would be much more of a return to classic Alice also.

Even though, I do not desire to buy the album. I'd love to know why it is not anywhere to be found here, because I'd like for it to be a success (yes, I complain about it on here, but I know most of you have it or will decide on your own whether you like it enough to purchase. I don't openly bash the album to people who are casual fans of Alice, because I would like them to hopefully help him be successful or give it a chance since we are all different) and be available to people who would like to have it.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 6:28 am 
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Billion Dollar Baby
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guttertrash wrote:
it sounds like Ezrin thought he was making a Panic At The Disco pop/punk album or 30 Minutes To Mars since he did actually produce their crap album

I think you're confusing 30 minutes from Mars with 30 Seconds From Mars. Both bands are pretty much the same but one's a bit more laid back.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 7:42 am 
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guttertrash wrote:
My whole issue is that this album is trying to sound pristine, but it is not. The guitars have no tone or character. They are razor thin and compressed to hell. They lose their audibility at times. Ever Fallen In Love turns into a rumble with no definition at all at times. Why does Alice need vocal effects on Fireball and You And All Your Friends? It's wonky. The album is so overproduced that it kills any edge that it would have. And Ezrin himself pulled a hipster in for god knows what reason. Parker Gispert is in an indie-rock band called The Whigs that is quite well known in the southeast U.S. He has always had incredible tone, but Ezrin finds a way to completely ruin it. I just don't get the reasoning behind bringing somebody like that in though when Ryan Roxie has written some incredible songs, and many that are classic Coop. I don't get the disconnect between the studio and the touring band at all. Between the ACG members and the band members, I guarantee they could make a better album than this, and it would be much more of a return to classic Alice also.

Even though, I do not desire to buy the album. I'd love to know why it is not anywhere to be found here, because I'd like for it to be a success (yes, I complain about it on here, but I know most of you have it or will decide on your own whether you like it enough to purchase. I don't openly bash the album to people who are casual fans of Alice, because I would like them to hopefully help him be successful or give it a chance since we are all different) and be available to people who would like to have it.


The album sounds fine to me. In fact I was surprised how well it flowed even though the songs vary in style. I think Ezrin did a great job as do the vast majority of the fans and the critics.

To me, the vocal effect on "Fireball" enhances the song. It reminds me of "Alma Mater" in a way. Although "You And All Your Friends" is not one of the better songs on the album, in my opinion, it's not because of the vocal effect. I'd love to hear John Lydon have a go at that one.

As far as Parker Gispert and whoever else Ezrin decided to have play on the album it was a decision made based on what he was trying to achieve. You may not like the results, but again, music is subjective. To me---the album sounds just fine. Also, there is no disconnect with the touring band. The band was simply not asked to participate on the album. Alice's touring band are hired hands to be used or not used as desired. I mean one could ask why didn't Desmond Child use The "Live In The Flesh" touring band for "Trash"? It's because there was something different in mind.

I'm sure Roger Glover's appearance has everything to do with Ezrin producing Deep Purple, and maybe he is working on something with Parker Gispert--who knows. I think it was Alice himself that asked for Billy Gibbons to be brought in, and his guitar parts sounds great. Ryan Roxie is a stellar guitarist who has made great contributions to Alice's catalog, but in this instance he was not used. Using your argument then one could ask why Wagner wasn't used on every album from 1975 until his death. After all, he was one of the most important collaborators in Alice's career.

The ACG was involved in this project and we hear the results. Are you saying that if the original band members got together and wrote and recorded with the current touring band we would have had better results? As far as "return to classic Coop" is concerned, this album has Alice all over it. How much more "classic Coop" can you get with several songs written by former original band members? It's 2017, not 1973. Times change, people change, styles change. Did you ever stop to think that maybe all involved did not want to rehash 1973?

Also, I'm quite certain that songs or song ideas were submitted by members of the touring band, along with past members of the Alice Cooper "family" of past collaborators. I'm guessing they weren't chosen because they did not fit what Ezrin was looking for--it's simple as that. I think that a few of the songs, namely "Holy Water" were not the best choices, but I wasn't paying to have the album made. In all honesty, I think Alice sounds like he was having a blast recording "Holy Water". I just find the song to be the weakest on the album. But what's odd is that it seems to be well liked by some if you look at another thread in the forum. So there you have it.

We live in 2017 where nearly everything is purchased online via physical product or download. I'm an old fart and even I buy 99% of my music online. I personally don't know anybody who rushes to the record store (we have one left in our area) to buy any new release. Our local Best Buy does not even carry cds other than a bargain bin near the registers. People who want the album will find it. Also, I think people are easily finding the album as last I heard it was #1 on Amazon.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 7:43 am 
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Babysquid wrote:
guttertrash wrote:
it sounds like Ezrin thought he was making a Panic At The Disco pop/punk album or 30 Minutes To Mars since he did actually produce their crap album

I think you're confusing 30 minutes from Mars with 30 Seconds From Mars. Both bands are pretty much the same but one's a bit more laid back.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 9:30 am 
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I think mr.barlow makes some excellent points re the use of mr.ezrin. I would imagine that if I had presented Alice with my wish list of producer and players, he would (very politely) have told me to take a hike. So I'd be left with no new album at all.
As it is I get a bunch of great songs which, considering I was convinced he was washed up and dying in the early 80s, is extraordinary. He has earned the right to do exactly what he wants when he wants and it's great that Bob is still around and giving Alice the motivation to get back in the studio


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:00 am 
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mr.barlow wrote:

For the most part--no one really cares. An album either sounds good or it sounds shitty, but to the untrained ear--especially the ears of 99% of listeners of rock n roll or pop--they haven't a clue.

I'll let the audiophiles sit and analyze every little nuance and obsess about brickwalls, compression and the like. Me, I'm just going to enjoy the songs.


Dead right.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:13 am 
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Dazdot wrote:
mr.barlow wrote:

For the most part--no one really cares. An album either sounds good or it sounds shitty, but to the untrained ear--especially the ears of 99% of listeners of rock n roll or pop--they haven't a clue.

I'll let the audiophiles sit and analyze every little nuance and obsess about brickwalls, compression and the like. Me, I'm just going to enjoy the songs.


Dead right.


There is nothing wrong in doing that and in general I agree.
But in turn there is also nothing wrong in pointing out how brickwalled the CD is. IF these things aren't mentioned and criticized (where appropriate) nothing will ever change.
If you play the vinyl back to back to the CD you start to realise how much of the music is lost sonically by brickwalling.

It's all something I've actually just recently been investigating in relation to Alice. It's shocking how much better some pressings/masterings of the albums sound to others, even to my uneducated ears.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:26 am 
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Billion Dollar Baby
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Si wrote:
Dazdot wrote:
mr.barlow wrote:

For the most part--no one really cares. An album either sounds good or it sounds shitty, but to the untrained ear--especially the ears of 99% of listeners of rock n roll or pop--they haven't a clue.

I'll let the audiophiles sit and analyze every little nuance and obsess about brickwalls, compression and the like. Me, I'm just going to enjoy the songs.


Dead right.


There is nothing wrong in doing that and in general I agree.
But in turn there is also nothing wrong in pointing out how brickwalled the CD is. IF these things aren't mentioned and criticized (where appropriate) nothing will ever change.
If you play the vinyl back to back to the CD you start to realise how much of the music is lost sonically by brickwalling.

It's all something I've actually just recently been investigating in relation to Alice. It's shocking how much better some pressings/masterings of the albums sound to others, even to my uneducated ears.


That's interesting . I have the vinyl and I've been playing it and haven't found it overly compressed like some have suggested. I don't have the CD to compare.
It should be pointed out that mastering and producing are two different processes and are mostly done by different people.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:31 am 
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Babysquid wrote:

That's interesting . I have the vinyl and I've been playing it and haven't found it overly compressed like some have suggested. I don't have the CD to compare.
It should be pointed out that mastering and producing are two different processes and are mostly done by different people.


Check out the images posted on this thread:
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=9484&p=295093#p295093

They show how the vinyl differs from the CD. The vinyl doesn`t appear to be anywhere near as compressed as as the CD.
Yes, production and mastering are completely different processes.


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