Paranormal Personality - the first single

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by GailsFriend » Thu Jun 15, 2017 7:10 pm

Something to feed your paranoia.....

http://bravewords.com/news/alice-cooper ... -streaming
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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by revinkevin » Fri Jun 16, 2017 1:42 pm

Upon repeated listening, I stick to my initial reaction. Sterile sounding that screams studio musicians and sounds nothing like Killer era rock which Alice alluded to. Why they went this way when he has a high energy touring band at his disposal is baffling to me. Hopefully the other songs don't follow this line and I would doubt that the two songs written by the original band would ever have a generic feel to them.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by TeresofBlood » Fri Jun 16, 2017 2:15 pm

revinkevin wrote:Upon repeated listening, I stick to my initial reaction. Sterile sounding that screams studio musicians and sounds nothing like Killer era rock which Alice alluded to. Why they went this way when he has a high energy touring band at his disposal is baffling to me. Hopefully the other songs don't follow this line and I would doubt that the two songs written by the original band would ever have a generic feel to them.
Dick Wagner was a studio musician before he and Alice realized how much they loved writing songs together. Because Alice is not a musician, the quality of his songs depend largely on the people he writes with (hence Along Came A Spider).

While his touring band might be great players, they all generally have very modern playing styles and more modern influences than seventies rock, so they might not be the best fit for Alice, especially if he's trying to evoke Killer.

This is a pretty good article that sums up what Tommy Denander brought to the table. Alice and Bob sought out songwriters who would bring the right flavor to the album and Denander delivered. And naturally, if you wrote the music, it's your baby and you want to be the one playing it on the record.

I can't speculate on whether or not the touring band offers up songwriting ideas to Alice, but it seems like many of them have their own side projects to focus on.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by Si » Fri Jun 16, 2017 2:42 pm

TeresofBlood wrote: While his touring band might be great players, they all generally have very modern playing styles and more modern influences than seventies rock,
This is true probably of Nita, who's personal tastes seems to head towards far heavier material then Alice Cooper, but not the rest of the band especially Ryan who is hugely influenced by bands from the 70s, especially Cheap Trick, and of course The Beatles.
TeresofBlood wrote: I can't speculate on whether or not the touring band offers up songwriting ideas to Alice, but it seems like many of them have their own side projects to focus on.
They do, the same way the original band guys have submitted material, and sometimes things are used even if they don`t get to play on them personally.

Tommy of course is heavily involved in the writing and performing on W2MN and HV's albums, and this new one as well, so basically you are looking to Ryan and Chuck as the other songwriters in the band. Nita's style isn`t really Alice's style (although I'm sure she could do it if asked) and I'm not sure if Glen writes music or not, but Ryan and Chuck obviously do, as their solo material and 'The Eyes Of Alice Cooper' prove beyond any doubt.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by guttertrash » Fri Jun 16, 2017 3:27 pm

TeresofBlood wrote:
revinkevin wrote:Upon repeated listening, I stick to my initial reaction. Sterile sounding that screams studio musicians and sounds nothing like Killer era rock which Alice alluded to. Why they went this way when he has a high energy touring band at his disposal is baffling to me. Hopefully the other songs don't follow this line and I would doubt that the two songs written by the original band would ever have a generic feel to them.
Dick Wagner was a studio musician before he and Alice realized how much they loved writing songs together. Because Alice is not a musician, the quality of his songs depend largely on the people he writes with (hence Along Came A Spider).

While his touring band might be great players, they all generally have very modern playing styles and more modern influences than seventies rock, so they might not be the best fit for Alice, especially if he's trying to evoke Killer.

This is a pretty good article that sums up what Tommy Denander brought to the table. Alice and Bob sought out songwriters who would bring the right flavor to the album and Denander delivered. And naturally, if you wrote the music, it's your baby and you want to be the one playing it on the record.

I can't speculate on whether or not the touring band offers up songwriting ideas to Alice, but it seems like many of them have their own side projects to focus on.
Dick Wagner was far from a studio musician. He was in the band The Frost, and pretty much the whole lineup for WTMN was in Lou Reed's touring band. Ryan and Chuck write a lot. It was said that the next album would be a band album in the very early stages. I have no idea why that was changed, but I can tell you it was most likely an Ezrin idea, since he had the "bright" idea of getting Larry Mullen, and the other guys all played on W2MN even though Denander was just on I Am Made Of You. Mullen's drumming is no worse than whoever played on the non-ACG tracks on that album, but both drummers sound pedestrian. It leads me to believe that Ezrin wanted them to play as simple as possible. Glen would have done no worse, and if it was with songs written by the touring band, I think he would have probably been pretty fantastic. As evidenced by the tone of W2MN and this album and the last two Phish and Deep Purple albums, I find Ezrin's current production ideas lacking. No grit and nothing memorable...

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by While Heaven Wept » Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:01 pm

guttertrash wrote: I find Ezrin's current production ideas lacking. No grit and nothing memorable...
Like a brick wall?

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by guttertrash » Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:08 pm

Instead of finding ways to complain about the opinions of those that disagree, why not give your own thought out rebuttal that contrasts with the opinion you disagree with that actually adds to the conversation?

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by guttertrash » Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:15 pm

To answer your question though, it's more like a brick house, because Ezrin's just letting it all hang out.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by revinkevin » Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:16 pm

Killer beat me to it. Wagner was a road dog before hooking up with Alice as was Steve Hunter. As for Deep Purples new release, I think it's real solid. Mostly because they retain that classic feel from back in the day. Steve Morse seems to be more Blackmore than Blackmore is these days. The single I heard off Blackmore's new release was craptaculary uninspired.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by guttertrash » Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:23 pm

revinkevin wrote:Killer beat me to it. Wagner was a road dog before hooking up with Alice as was Steve Hunter. As for Deep Purples new release, I think it's real solid. Mostly because they retain that classic feel from back in the day. Steve Morse seems to be more Blackmore than Blackmore is these days. The single I heard off Blackmore's new release was craptaculary uninspired.
It does sound like Deep Purple, but the tones and mix are much more subpar on the last albums compared to any of their previous albums. The guitar has no real bite, even though, Morse's riffs are fantastic. I feel like the songs will more than likely fit in and sound stellar live.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by pitkin88 » Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:37 pm

While Heaven Wept wrote:
guttertrash wrote: I find Ezrin's current production ideas lacking. No grit and nothing memorable...
Like a brick wall?

Have to agree sadly Ezrin's sound is brickwalled these days.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by guttertrash » Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:46 pm

pitkin88 wrote:
While Heaven Wept wrote:
guttertrash wrote: I find Ezrin's current production ideas lacking. No grit and nothing memorable...
Like a brick wall?

Have to agree sadly Ezrin's sound is brickwalled these days.
Dynamics have left the building...

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by Si » Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:10 pm

pitkin88 wrote:
While Heaven Wept wrote:
guttertrash wrote: I find Ezrin's current production ideas lacking. No grit and nothing memorable...
Like a brick wall?

Have to agree sadly Ezrin's sound is brickwalled these days.
Surely it's the mastering that brickwalls a CD, not the production or mix, hence why many 'remastered' CD actually have less dynamic range then the originals.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by pitkin88 » Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:14 pm

Well it's Ezrin's baby and if his masterer is crap it's down to Ezrin to deal with it.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by guttertrash » Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:33 pm

I feel like it is a problem due to both producer and masterer. Rick Rubin being a major proponent, because he makes the mix so loud that there is little to work with much of the time. And sometimes even nothing like with Death Magnetic. The guy who mastered Death Magnetic didn't want his name attached due to the extremely brickwalled production that left the music clipping.

Modern rock drum production is a huge issue for me. I hate the fact that it dominates the mix on most rock and metal albums now, and this is due to the producer. Everything is getting mixed and compressed to fit along with that. When you produce something loud in general, you have to make everything else loud to fit in, and it just creates issues. In the mastering phase, everything will be pushed to the max before clipping these days for most major label albums, but it can still be mixed to keep from exacerbating the problem.

A great sounding album based on the three tracks that I have heard is Styx's new one The Mission. It sounds very much like Pieces of Eight.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by revinkevin » Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:44 pm

The purist say going digital from analog is the main culprit. Digital sure is easier but sterile. I hear the word compression tossed around a lot too but I don't get that deep. If it sounds good driving in my car I'm happy.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by guttertrash » Fri Jun 16, 2017 6:01 pm

The sterile sound generally comes from two situations. Both of them have to do with recording separately, be it in different rooms or at different times. The atmosphere and the microphone bleeding when bands played live together in one room added to the warmth to music. You can listen to the overdubs from early albums, and you can tell that they tend to sound more sterile a lot of times. Pretties For You had too much bleeding on the basic tracks due to microphones not being set-up properly and tested before recording, but the overdubbed guitar tracks sound sterile and are too high in the mix, so it gives the album an even weirder sound.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by HORRORHOLIC » Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:42 pm

I just read that article and a few parts especially stood out to me.

"“In a big way, it really captures the core of the album."



“It’s in many ways like getting to time-travel back and hear new music from Alice. Some of it’s so amazing that I get goosebumps every time I listen."

Really ? Because I'm not getting that at all, and I really hope this song doesn't "capture the core of the album"

The more I hear about this the more I feel Alice really needs to get away from Ezrin. I'm not sure if it's because they're too comfortable with each other, but their creativity together seems to have run it's course, and I think Alice needs to be pushed a little harder creatively. I still agree Alice working with Rick Rubin would be perfect.
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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by Saint&Sinner » Sun Jun 18, 2017 10:12 am

I find it amazing that Bob Ezrin is being labelled as a bad producer. He is superb in bringing out every nuance of each instrument, alowing each instrument to wash over you. Some of the masters are mixed louder than is preferable but it is hardly "death magnetic" levels. I have a very expensive stereo system and am an avid audiophile. W2MN sounds fantastic on headphones or through speakers. Bob ezrin is a good producer. He tends to get the best out of alice (W2MN is a great album) and he is not afraid to experiment, sometimes that works, sometimes it doesn't but its better to try than just stay the same on every album.
His production on W2MN is fresh with lots of space in the mix allowing everything to breathe, i think you guys are bemoaning his production style because it is different from "the classic albums" but it is not bad, ACAS is a bad production from top to bottom but W2MN is demonstrably not a bad production job.
I am still not listening to the single as i want to wait for the album to be released so its all fresh and new at once, i will judge it on its own merrits. I would never have hired the players he has, but if it works i dont care.
Yeah i would love to have nita shred over some classic 80's style metal but that aint gonna happen. If they Cant bring the writing chops (as discussed earlier their writing styles/influences might prevent them from working for alice) then you go where the writing is.
I think the album will rock, i have high hopes for this one.

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Re: Paranormal Personality - the first single

Post by guttertrash » Sun Jun 18, 2017 4:27 pm

He's not a bad producer. His production sounds professional, but it sounds like everything else that comes out these days. It's lifeless, stiff, and faceless like pretty much anything produced with a sterile, modern sound. The major difference in ACAS and W2MN is that you didn't have a producer on ACAS that understood how to get the proper sounds and tones from the instruments, but the overall mix isn't too far removed from W2MN. He was going for pretty much the same approach, but he didn't know how to get it. SO my issue is not about the professionalism, it is about the approach. No matter how "classic rock" a riff sounds, you can't make it sound classic without a production style that gives it the proper setting, and that is my issue with the new single as you will witness when the album is released. If people like it, that is fine. I just don't like having musicians talk about what they have made as being something that it is not.

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