Kane Roberts

[AlongCameASpider27]

Back to Kane, his guitar work especially on RYFAY (my personal favorite album of Alice's) is phenomenal...Freedom and all of side 2 especially Roses on White Lace and Prince of Darkness are just so spine tingly awesome!!!!

[mr.barlow]

From RemarkablyInsincere:
You also don't "bump into walls" with dyslexia.

I think that's a reference to being in love.

Exactly--the song is about falling in love and the feelings that go with it. It wss not meant to be taken literally as him singing about being afflicted with dyslexia.

To me it's the most novel and original song about falling in love that I've ever heard--in fact I'd go so far as to call it genius.


Also, I think my sarcasm did not translate to the printed word. My point about the comparisons of the songs of Dada and the late 1980s songs is that there is no comparison. In my opinion not one song from that era can seriously be compared to any songs on Dada. Dada is a whole different level. It is magnificent while the others are mediocre.

Now with that being said---I will say that side 2 of Raise Your Fist And Yell is incredible. I still wouldn't put it in the same league as Dada but it is the best Alice gave us in that period. It is stellar and deserves proper credit.

The rest however we all know was "dumbed down" on purpose in order to appeal to a certain demographic--namely suburban teenagers. To be fair that has to be taken into account when criticizing the lyrics and music of that era but I still can't see how anyone can remotely think that the output of that era can compare to almost anything Alice had done prior to that time-and that includes L&W.

[SickThings]

From RemarkablyInsincere:
To me it's the most novel and original song about falling in love that I've ever heard--in fact I'd go so far as to call it genius.

I agree! I've always liked "Dyslexia."

Hunter

[RemarkablyInsincere]

Exactly--the song is about falling in love and the feelings that go with it. It wss not meant to be taken literally as him singing about being afflicted with dyslexia.

I think this song, like many, is written metaphorically.

It can be overlooked, but Alice's understanding of dyslexia is off the mark and thus the lyrics don't really make a lot of sense by definition.

To me it's the most novel and original song about falling in love that I've ever heard--in fact I'd go so far as to call it genius.

I wouldn't go that far.

Also, I think my sarcasm did not translate to the printed word. My point about the comparisons of the songs of Dada and the late 1980s songs is that there is no comparison. In my opinion not one song from that era can seriously be compared to any songs on Dada. Dada is a whole different level. It is magnificent while the others are mediocre.

I like DADA, but you're really overrating it.

[mr.barlow]

Exactly--the song is about falling in love and the feelings that go with it. It wss not meant to be taken literally as him singing about being afflicted with dyslexia.

I think this song, like many, is written metaphorically.

It can be overlooked, but Alice's understanding of dyslexia is off the mark and thus the lyrics don't really make a lot of sense by definition.

To me it's the most novel and original song about falling in love that I've ever heard--in fact I'd go so far as to call it genius.

I wouldn't go that far.

Also, I think my sarcasm did not translate to the printed word. My point about the comparisons of the songs of Dada and the late 1980s songs is that there is no comparison. In my opinion not one song from that era can seriously be compared to any songs on Dada. Dada is a whole different level. It is magnificent while the others are mediocre.

I like DADA, but you're really overrating it.

To be honest, I think it would be safe to say, that Alice was not concerned with the exact defintion of dyslexia. The song is about falling in love and how it distorts a person's perceptions. It's about how love oftens makes you see thing differently than they really appear.

Also, it's a fine example in the art of song lyric writing. I would go so far to say that the whole song was written around the line "is dis love--or dyslexia". Again--it was not meant to be taken literally or to be a song about the exact medical condition of dyslexia.

Also it fits into the overall theme of the album which is confusion.

Again--to me it's one of the most novel and witty approaches to describe the feeling of falling in love ever to be recorded. It IS genius.

As far as overating Dada is concerned, that may be true, but it's safe to say that it's light years better than Contrictor, RYFAY, Trash and even Hey Stoopid. Those albums were designed by choice to be dumbed down offerings. They were made specifically to cater to teenagers. Dada on the other hand was the ONLY album Alice ever made that was free from any commercial demands outside of the first two albums. It was pure art--and great sognwriting. That's why it's timeless and that's why it holds up much better than any of those late 1980s albums.

I will let the lyrics speak for themselves:

"We drove away in her Mercedes Benz ,dirty blonde split ends in the breeze" (No Man's Land)

compared to

"You got your sugar you got your spice you got a kitten now isn't that nice". (Give It Up)

I'll be happy to continue if you'd like.

[Street Schizo]

I had to think about this for awhile. I loved Kane at the time. Alice was back and that's all I cared about. I don't think the original band reuniting would have gone anywhere in 86. He had to go the "metal" route especially since so many bands at the time were citing him as an influence. I thought RYFAY was amazing. Especially Side 2. Constrictors drum machine killed me. I hated that sound but I didn't mind most of the songs. These days I never listen to those albums. But there aren't too many albums like them that I do listen to anymore. I was 16, sue me. Those albums have a nice place in my heart though.
I hated Trash at the time but enjoy most of it today. Bed Of Nails, which features Kane, is one of my favs as well as Dangerous Tonight from Hey Stoopid. Sounds like Kane on that too. Not sure if that's accurate though. I like some of Kane's solo work too. I would say he's a very good 80's style guitarist. And I liked what he did even if most of it didn't have staying power for me. You just can't top things like Killer.

[RemarkablyInsincere]

They were made specifically to cater to teenagers. Dada on the other hand was the ONLY album Alice ever made that was free from any commercial demands outside of the first two albums. It was pure art--and great sognwriting.

You do know that much of the Alice catalog up to that point could be considered as catered to teenagers.

That's why it's timeless and that's why it holds up much better than any of those late 1980s albums.

Sorry, I don't think the production values on that album allow it to be considered "timeless".

I will let the lyrics speak for themselves:

"We drove away in her Mercedes Benz ,dirty blonde split ends in the breeze" (No Man's Land)

compared to

"You got your sugar you got your spice you got a kitten now isn't that nice". (Give It Up)

I'll be happy to continue if you'd like.

You'll notice, I never said those albums were better than DADA, all I said was that the song "He's Back (The Man Behind The Mask)" is a best song to come out of any of either of those albums.

It's not only brilliant musically, but also lyrically. Too bad "Constrictor" didn't have more on that level because the rest of the album is pretty lackluster.

I like DADA, but it's taken on mythical proportions among some of the fan base. It's similar to "Music From The Elder" with KISS. Fans rating it as way better than it is for some odd reason.

[Saint&Sinner]

Music from the eldar is a valid comparison. Both albums are the culmination of both artists experimental phase/low phase (however you want to call it) before both artists rejuvenated themselves with constrictor/RYFAY and Creatures of the night/Lick it up I think part of the attraction is the "underdog album" and its not as "obvious" as BDB or killer. (or destroyer or rock and roll over)
Although music from the eldar is almost all gubbins (except ace's song which wasn't even up to his usual standards) where as DADA does have at least half a good album.
DADA is not timeless, far from it. It dates terribly, this is not necessarily a bad thing its just a fact. The same way BDB, RYFAY and Brutal planet date to their times.

People bemoan that of an 80's sound. personally i love the 80s sound.

Kane was a skilled player with a talent for great hooks, killer riffs and explosive solos. His style is distinctive even now and that is no bad thing. Again people seem to have grown out of the 80's metal style, that's fine. I love it still.
So its not poetry like some claim DADA to be, this is not the be all and end all of music (and DADA doesn't exactly compare favorably to someone of true mastery like leonard cohen), It's just one part of the jigsaw. I just happen to think that the rest of the jigsaw was pretty damn effective with kane at the helm.

[Devon]

Fans rating it as way better than it is for some odd reason.

Because to them it is as good as they feel it is, they just like it more than you do. There isn't a such thing as "better than it is."

[RemarkablyInsincere]

There's a difference with saying "I like something better" vs. insisting something is the greatest thing ever just cause you like it.