Lace & Whiskey and Maurice Escargot

[rtbuck]

I really would have loved to have seen this tour but I didn't discover Alice until I bought the Alice Cooper Show shortly after its release. I wish there would have been a full show filmed from the tour. I seen the Alice Cooper & Friends show but that was cut up pretty bad. I really enjoyed the Saginaw radio broadcast. Alice's vocals sounded mean on that show(much better than the Alice Cooper Show in my opinion).

...the Lace and Whiskey album... I can't say I love the album as a whole but I do like it. I always did love the riff for It's Hot Tonight( I really love the snippet of the riff they played on that SanDiego 1979 radio broadcast) and It's Hot Tonight is one of my favorite Coop tunes from the post ACG mid-late 70's era. Lace and Whiskey is decent and I would have rather seen a Maurice Escargot B & W video for that tune. Road Rats is a good tune & I love the theatrical King of the Silver Screen. What killed the album for me at the time I bought it in the late 70's were the final 3 songs although now I really like My God now but being a teenager heavy into hard rock/metal I just couldn't get into any of those 3. I did actually enjoy Ubangi Stomp even though I looked at it as a comedy piece at first(I couldn't picture Alice doing a rockabilly tune like that). That song did have an impact on me because I ended up being a big fan of rockabilly a couple of years later and am still heavy into it

[Rhapsody of Fire]

Yes we must all love everything. Thanks for the help with my speling. Skools out!!

I didn't say that you must all love everything. It's your right to dislike this album, but you don't have the right to denigrate it. Sorry for the French spelling lesson. As for me, I don't mind to be corrected if I do an error in English, it's the only way to get perfect. [/quote]


Please show me where in the rules it says you cannot denigrate an album. How about you actually commenting on the album rather than being all perturbed like?[/quote]

I believe there are NO rules. No comments about the album.

[Rhapsody of Fire]

Ballads, disco, country, lack luster rockabilly and a silly film noire detective character that was completely uninteresting. Directionless rather than diverse. I really wish it had been shelved and that someone had had his ear and told him it was crap. Laid back drivel with Ezrin and a host of others. Too much coke and sunbathing and hanging around the pool with Mickey Dolenz.

Negative criticism, again.... BTW, it's film noir, not noire.

Yes we must all love everything. Thanks for the help with my speling. Skools out!!

[MrD Returns]

This was around the time KISS replaced Alice as my favorite live act and most played music.
Gene Simmons was on stage breathing fire and puking blood playing hard assed rock and roll and in the meantime Alice is onstage playing disco and dancing with chickens. It was horrible. A couple of pretty good songs on this one but other than that this was the beginning of the end for me as far as Alice was concerned. Then after FTF well ... I didn't buy another new Alice Cooper album until the end of the 90's.

And don't give me all that baloney about how brilliant DaDa and Zipper and Constictor was because they were awful as well. Glad I didn't spend money on them when they were first released because I would have been doubly disappointed.

[Daggers & Contracts]

This was around the time KISS replaced Alice as my favorite live act and most played music.
Gene Simmons was on stage breathing fire and puking blood playing hard assed rock and roll and in the meantime Alice is onstage playing disco and dancing with chickens. It was horrible. A couple of pretty good songs on this one but other than that this was the beginning of the end for me as far as Alice was concerned. Then after FTF well ... I didn't buy another new Alice Cooper album until the end of the 90's.

And don't give me all that baloney about how brilliant DaDa and Zipper and Constictor was because they were awful as well. Glad I didn't spend money on them when they were first released because I would have been doubly disappointed.

I concur, although I do like Special Forces (1st Live Show) & Flush The Fashion he lost me until Trash.

[mr.barlow]

This was around the time KISS replaced Alice as my favorite live act and most played music.
Gene Simmons was on stage breathing fire and puking blood playing hard assed rock and roll and in the meantime Alice is onstage playing disco and dancing with chickens. It was horrible. A couple of pretty good songs on this one but other than that this was the beginning of the end for me as far as Alice was concerned. Then after FTF well ... I didn't buy another new Alice Cooper album until the end of the 90's.

And don't give me all that baloney about how brilliant DaDa and Zipper and Constictor was because they were awful as well. Glad I didn't spend money on them when they were first released because I would have been doubly disappointed.

Let's put it this way--Zipper Catches Skin is more original and brilliant than ANYTHING ever produced by Kiss. A concept like Dada on the other hand would be impossible to grasp by any member of Kiss as they have not the talent or the brains to produce such an album. Now--Constrictor--that ranks right up there with the very best of Kiss--when it comes to mindless, generic rock n roll music.

Alice was an innovator. Kiss are immitators. I'll take Alice and the dancing chickens over Gene's tired stolen schtick any day of the week. Also, I'd rank Lace & Whiskey as being lightyears better than ANY Kiss album.

Face it--Kiss sucks and have always sucked.

[Devon]

Zipper Catches Skin is more original and brilliant than ANYTHING ever produced by Kiss.

Yeah, that's the ticket...

[tommycooper]

Always loved My God. Big production for a big subject. Loved it even more years later when I finally saw the lyrics and knew what he was singing about way down in the mix! That big space in I Never Wrote Those Songs became much easier to deal with when CDs appeared and I no longer had to listen to what seemed like 5 minutes of Snap, Crackle and Pop on the LP till the song started again

[jacknifejohnny]

Saw Tommy Cooper at Bailey's in Watford years ago, bleedin' hilarious

[pitkin88]

This was around the time KISS replaced Alice as my favorite live act and most played music.
Gene Simmons was on stage breathing fire and puking blood playing hard assed rock and roll and in the meantime Alice is onstage playing disco and dancing with chickens. It was horrible. A couple of pretty good songs on this one but other than that this was the beginning of the end for me as far as Alice was concerned. Then after FTF well ... I didn't buy another new Alice Cooper album until the end of the 90's.

And don't give me all that baloney about how brilliant DaDa and Zipper and Constictor was because they were awful as well. Glad I didn't spend money on them when they were first released because I would have been doubly disappointed.

Let's put it this way--Zipper Catches Skin is more original and brilliant than ANYTHING ever produced by Kiss. A concept like Dada on the other hand would be impossible to grasp by any member of Kiss as they have not the talent or the brains to produce such an album. Now--Constrictor--that ranks right up there with the very best of Kiss--when it comes to mindless, generic rock n roll music.

Alice was an innovator. Kiss are immitators. I'll take Alice and the dancing chickens over Gene's tired stolen schtick any day of the week. Also, I'd rank Lace & Whiskey as being lightyears better than ANY Kiss album.

Face it--Kiss sucks and have always sucked.

Around Kiss Alive they were about to engulf Alice in flames. I would take Alive over Lace and Whiskey any day and I am not really a Kiss fan at all. At one point they had the best live show on the planet.

[thenightmare92]

I really would have loved to have seen this tour but I didn't discover Alice until I bought the Alice Cooper Show shortly after its release. I wish there would have been a full show filmed from the tour. I seen the Alice Cooper & Friends show but that was cut up pretty bad. I really enjoyed the Saginaw radio broadcast. Alice's vocals sounded mean on that show(much better than the Alice Cooper Show in my opinion).

I agree. Wish I was around to see this show. I've heard recordings in which Alice sounds much worse than he does in The Alice Cooper Show and it doesn't make any difference, still wish I could've seen it. Oddly enough I would have rather seen him in '77 when he sounded worse vocally but had the backing band including Wagner and Hunter opposed to '78 when he sounded better vocally but had a different band.

As for the album I enjoy it. I can listen to every song on it with 'You and Me' getting skipped the most. I realize it doesn't fit well with his other albums but I don't think it's bad

[darkmenace]

I've only a seen a few bad Alice shows (probably seen him live around 15 times) and they were Silver Screen in '77 and Flush the Fashion in '80.

I can understand people wanting to see the Lace & Whiskey show out of curiosity but to see it live at the time was pretty bad. I went with a friend and his younger sister and we had been building up Alice for a long time and it was embarrassing. She concluded "It was just a bunch of silly little vignettes" which it was.

The "Flush the Fashion" tour was coming off the great Madhouse Rock show and paled by comparison. It was a stripped down presentation to coincide with punk and new wave and was just plain flat. I believe I saw a worse than average show in Cleveland which has been written up by other reviewers as a poor outing. Lots and lots of dead time between acts killed the momentum for Alice.

[Railwayman]

I quite like L&W but for me the team had just run out of gas. Some songs like It's Hot Tonight, Road Rats and King... stand up to scrutiny but other Dammed and No More.. less so, but as Alice has said before, the nature of songs being played on the radio had changed and No More... was possibly an reaction to this.

[revinkevin]

Horrible album. Just horrible. And Alice as Escargot was a damn embarrassment. When Alice showed up on the Johnny Carson Show dressed like a Bogart detective with dancing chickens singing to a taped recording, I just wanted to puke. Hard to be more un rock n roll as that. Could not believe this was the same guy behind releases like Killer, BB, LITD or who was banned by tv and radio stations. Some may call it exploring different directions but if you were there it was a hugely misguided effort by someone who was obviously having some dependency problems that were carrying over into his business ventures.

[pitkin88]

Horrible album. Just horrible. And Alice as Escargot was a damn embarrassment. When Alice showed up on the Johnny Carson Show dressed like a Bogart detective with dancing chickens singing to a taped recording, I just wanted to puke. Hard to be more un rock n roll as that. Could not believe this was the same guy behind releases like Killer, BB, LITD or who was banned by tv and radio stations. Some may call it exploring different directions but if you were there it was a hugely misguided effort by someone who was obviously having some dependency problems that were carrying over into his business ventures.

Spot on. Over indulgent drivel. Someone really should have told him he was killing the fan base. Did he really think he could carry on with this Clouseau character and people would like it? Kiss must have been pissing in their spandex with laughter. Hey we will take your audience.

[concolz]

Kiss released 'Love Gun' in 1977. It's a big, steaming pile of aural horse manure - the music's about as cutting-edge as a third-rate Glitter Band, whilst the lyrics are sexist, misogynistic garbage.

'Lace And Whiskey' has, for the most part, intelligent lyrics, a diverse range of subject matter and broad, eclectic musical styles. It could have been a good album IF the main participants had bothered to pull all those strands together and apply some proper quality controls. But, for a variety of reasons, they couldn't/didn't - so we end up with a couple of really atrocious tracks, and an overall lacklustre disappointment. Yet, poor though 'L&W' is, it's still got more artistic integrity than 'Love Gun'.

[mr.barlow]

I have always thought that L&W, the new character and the tour were a very real attempt to take Alice VERY mainstream--and perhaps keep him there. I think it was a case of excess on all accounts including alcoholism and an idea careening wildly out of control. Who knows--maybe if the "Vegas" style schtick worked we could have ended up with an "Alice Cooper Show" television variety show like Sonny & Cher, Donnie & Marie and The Captain & Tennille. I truly believe that that's what they were going for with this whole new direction. We all know of Alice's love for tv, camp, showbiz and the like. If the thing worked and he ended up on American tv it would have got him off the road and perhaps led to bigger things on tv or Hollywood. If the album had some better production, song selection and cohesivness along with a clear sober mind--it might have worked. If it did--the whole history of Alice could have been very different.

At any rate--the whole damn thing was an epic flop. Alice and Shep were wise enough to get right back to classic Alice and rock sound with From The Inside and it helped him gain back some respect with his fanbase.

Then came another change with the character but this time it needed to be done as the musical trends were rapidly changing and no one wanted bloated music, production and stage spectacles. This time the character changed--but still had an edge. They learned from Maurice Escargot.

Then when it all nearly ended after Dada--Shep and Alice once again reverted back to the classic character to launch the comeback. I really think they both learned a great deal from Lace & Whiskey and Escargot, namely the boundaries of how far they could move away from the character without alientating fans.

Maurice Escargot may actually have been the guy that eventually saved Alice Cooper.

[Devon]

I think on some levels albums like "Lace and Whiskey" is what pushed that demographic toward KISS and "Destroyer" even more. KISS was doing what Alice wasn't at the time.. Rockin.

[mr.barlow]

I think on some levels albums like "Lace and Whiskey" is what pushed that demographic toward KISS and "Destroyer" even more. KISS was doing what Alice wasn't at the time.. Rockin.

I agree with you. I think Alice's missteps directly led to Kiss gaining in popularity. They basically stole the whole stage show concept from Alice--BUT--they improved on it and made it even bigger-as much as I hate to admit it! Alice was going with vaudeville, camp and Vegas showmanship while Kiss was ramping up the rock n roll stage show. Alice may have gained a few housewives while Kiss gained legions of new fans.

Fortunately, Alice and Shep saw that they made a HUGE mistake and tried to reverse it rather quickly with From The Inside and Madhouse Rock. The thing is it was bad timing for them as they were unable to gain momentum due to the rapidly changing rock scene to the stripped down punk that was then in vogue. Alice got back in character and it was again working for him and then due to the changing tastes he had to quickly change again. This again--confused fans who came back and well....it all started falling apart--both personally and professionally for Alice.

Remember in those same years 1977-1986, Kiss also saw their career rise and fall and rise again. They made their comeback the same way as Alice on the "hair metal" bandwagon.

[Daggers & Contracts]

Kiss released 'Love Gun' in 1977. It's a big, steaming pile of aural horse manure - the music's about as cutting-edge as a third-rate Glitter Band, whilst the lyrics are sexist, misogynistic garbage.
Yet, poor though 'L&W' is, it's still got more artistic integrity than 'Love Gun'.

You've got that right! When a friend of mine got his copy of Love Gun and invited me over for its' debut, I was checking out the cover & the liner notes when he pulled out a cardboard and paper "Pop Gun" and it was over. I resigned from the Kiss Army at that point! Whatever Cooper did was gonna be better than theses schmuks! Haven't bought a studio Kiss LP since.