Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

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pitkin88
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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by pitkin88 » Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:14 am

I'd like to ask GDNM what the Buxton family thought about Alice not attending Glen's funeral? I believe he was playing that night but wouldn't consider cancelling the show as he wanted the money.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by Crazy Little Child » Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:55 am

Lucius Morthem wrote:Ok, 2 people. Who prefers MOL, That's a big achievement, generally, everybody says that Muscle of Love was bad (although, I Like it a lot)

By the way, I Think the break up was necessary,When people don't share a same vision, if you let them together longer, the worst will happen
While the break up was possibly inevitable, we can still be disapointed. And further, a reunion shouldn't be out of the questions!

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by GNDM » Wed Oct 09, 2013 3:00 am

pitkin88 wrote:I'd like to ask GDNM what the Buxton family thought about Alice not attending Glen's funeral? I believe he was playing that night but wouldn't consider cancelling the show as he wanted the money.
One thing people forget. If Alice HAD attended the funeral...it would have become a media circus - with Alice, not Glen, as the center of attention. Alice called Glen's parents and Janice as soon as he heard of Glen's passing. I am sure everyone wished AC could have attended, but maybe it was a no-win situation.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by pinkerton » Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:48 am

TodayMueller wrote:
TodayMueller wrote:
A_MichaelUK wrote:>Apparently, Alice was in Chile in '95.

I don't think that's the show Lucius Morthem is referring to

No, but it answers Pinkerton's question.

- And, I even answered it without blaming her for not looking through this whole site to find it herself.
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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by pinkerton » Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:52 am

Lucius Morthem wrote:Ok, 2 people. Who prefers MOL, That's a big achievement, generally, everybody says that Muscle of Love was bad (although, I Like it a lot)

By the way, I Think the break up was necessary,When people don't share a same vision, if you let them together longer, the worst will happen
I like MOL too. Never thought of comparing it to WTMNM. they are two very different animals. Its like comparing apples to oranges.

Yes, the break up was probably necessary. But, I like they way they sounded together, much like I love the way the Beatles sound together. On their own they're great, but together they are flipping gods!
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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by Toronto Bob » Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:10 am

I think the confirmed news that AC became an evangelical christian really troubled me. I mean I understand him needing a lifeline to get him through his addiction but evangelical christianity? ugh.

Music wise, there's quite a few missed opportunities but to list them all would make it seem like I'm not a fan so I'll limit it to the box sets TLACOAC and Old School.

The first one was a bloated cash grab and the second was a dishearteneing realization that no one in the organization was able to have the foresight and properly archive the band's history.

WTMN2 wasn't a disappointment, it just live down to my expectations.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by dadascot » Wed Oct 09, 2013 12:27 pm

The first time I put RYFAY on the turntable was the first, not touring DADA, no stageshow for W2MN.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by darkmenace » Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:31 pm

I'm not going to comment about personal decisions Alice has made because it's hard to put yourself in someone else's shoes without living their life and knowing all the facts. Hence whether he attended Glen's funeral or helped Dennis financially is not something I would judge.

Since people are griping I'll toss in something minor: It doesn't make sense to me that Alice consistently praises easy listening Burt Bacharach and wants to see him nominated for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame but condemns modern acts like Mumford and Sons for not being Rock and Roll enough.

I'm not a fan of the music of either one so perhaps I'm missing a subtle distinction on how to classify rock music but on the surface this doesn't make sense to me.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by tim10cc » Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:56 pm

dadascot wrote:The first time I put RYFAY on the turntable was the first, not touring DADA, no stageshow for W2MN.
Did you feel RYFAY was too metallic? Just curious.

But I feel you on the other 2. It would of been nice to have a tour with either Zipper or DaDa and especially the w2mn.

One other disappointment is the lack of live footage from some of the tours Alice has done throughout the years. It would be nice if some footage would resurface, if it was ever out there.


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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by mestreech » Wed Oct 09, 2013 3:17 pm

A big disappointment and maybe a careerstopper was the fact that the musicstores put Alice in the METALsection.
Not many people look in that section unless you're a metalfan.
So many titles did not got any attention at all.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by mestreech » Wed Oct 09, 2013 3:18 pm

tim10cc wrote:
dadascot wrote:One other disappointment is the lack of live footage from some of the tours Alice has done throughout the years. It would be nice if some footage would resurface, if it was ever out there.


Tim
I agree on that part.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by Crazy Little Child » Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:23 pm

darkmenace wrote:
Since people are griping I'll toss in something minor: It doesn't make sense to me that Alice consistently praises easy listening Burt Bacharach and wants to see him nominated for the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame but condemns modern acts like Mumford and Sons for not being Rock and Roll enough.
I can see where his like of lounge shmaltz is a real thing (just listen to the horns on WTMN, or "Some Folks" in it's entirety). But i think it's fair to say there's nothing in his music that really approaches country or folk (okay, there's "Umbangi Stomp", but that's about it), so i'm going to suggest it's just a matter of personal preference.

That said, i would agree with you that there are no shortage of country/folk tinged rock musicians who should be in the RnR Hall of Fame long before Bacharach!

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by cooperrocks » Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:28 pm

The good has definitely outweighed the bad, but I try to be objective when it comes to things that disappointed me as a fan.

1)The Operation Rock N Roll Tour. That tour had financial problems basically from day one and was poorly conceived. I am not saying that was Alice's fault in any way, but the "Hey Stoopid" album was far superior to "Trash" in my opinion. I really think there could be more done in way of promotion. The album had the potential to be a huge hit which would have given Alice back to back big selling albums.
2) The lack of a real tour for The Last Temptation and more promotion of current albums. Take WTMN 2 for example (which I happen to love), there was no real pushing of the album in the live show other than the one single for several months. By the time songs like "Caffeine" were added the album was an afterthought. I know people don't buy albums any more, but show more confidence in the album.
3)This isn't aimed at Alice but fans/radio in general. The original group was great and put out awesome albums, no question. But I hate it when people can't get past the original band and dismiss all of Alice's later work. There are some truly great solo albums along the way such as WTMN, FTI, Dada, Brutal Planet, etc.
I would like to see Alice push his new albums a little bit more.
4)The Raise the Dead section of the new tour. I think most Alice fans would rather hear four Alice songs than four cover tunes.
5)Along the same lines, I would like to see a more diverse playlist. The tours have gotten kind of redundant. I understand you have to play the hits to a degree, but I have always hated the argument that bands don't change playlists because the fans mainly know the hits. If someone is a true fan of a band, then they should know all the songs or most of them anyway. Someone like Alice (and many others) play smaller venues now which means many of the fans are diehards. I know that Alice's management said they dropped "The Man Behind the Mask" in the United States because of the crowd not responding much. One, many fans have commented that was a highly for them. Two, using that argument with the exception of a few solo tunes like "Poison" and songs off of WTMN, they may as well drop all of those songs. Do people know "Dirty Diamonds" any more than they do "The Man Behind the Mask?"
6)The dismissal of most of the 80's albums. I know RYFAY gets a mixed response on this board, but I know of many people who love that album and it gets asked about a lot. It also wouldn't take a lot of time to perhaps put together a four or five minute melody of the early 80's album just doing some pieced together snippets. Those kinds of surprises are what often makes a show special.
7)Finally, and I am not sure this involves Alice much, but the touring stops that are made. There are so many cities that Alice would do well in that get ignored. Some of the regular cities, Alice plays in have been overdone because Alice plays there every year. Let me give you an example of something I don't understand. In the late 90's and early 2000's, Alice played the Tunica area several times and often sold out. For the last 10 years, he hasn't played there despite showing there is a fanbase. Some of you would argue that is up to promoters, but that is not completely true. A good friend of recently contacted a place in Memphis, Tennessee. According to the venue, they have requested and have had several fans ask for Alice and were told "Alice is skipping the market this year." Memphis is a market that hasn't been played for years. Nashville (which has a lot of Alice fans) is a market that only has been played a few times, the same for other southern cities as well. I am sure those of you living in other areas would say the same thing.

Just my two cents and I respect everyone else's opinion.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by AlongCameASpider27 » Wed Oct 09, 2013 5:57 pm

Toronto Bob wrote:I think the confirmed news that AC became an evangelical christian really troubled me. I mean I understand him needing a lifeline to get him through his addiction but evangelical christianity? ugh.

Music wise, there's quite a few missed opportunities but to list them all would make it seem like I'm not a fan so I'll limit it to the box sets TLACOAC and Old School.

The first one was a bloated cash grab and the second was a dishearteneing realization that no one in the organization was able to have the foresight and properly archive the band's history.

WTMN2 wasn't a disappointment, it just live down to my expectations.
And what is wrong with being a Christian? I am not going to turn this into a big religious debate but I am a Christian and it means a lot to me. Further, I've seen how Alice is very proud and open about it...if he feels God played a huge part in him surviving into this day, then how is that a bad thing? I applaud him...just another reason why I think the world of the man....

My only beef ever with Alice is that I have not been blessed to see songs from my favorite album RYFAY live...the trilogy, Prince of Darkness, and Freedom are a must for me one day...
"Freedom to rock, freedom to talk, freeeedom, raise your fist and yell!"

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by A_MichaelUK » Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:54 pm

>I Always have thought that people who said that the Alice Cooper Group shouldn't have broken up, I Ask them.... Don't you like Welcome to my nightmare? Goes To Hell? From The Inside ?

That is a good question. Anybody who still complains about the fact that the broke up (which is laughable since it was almost forty years ago), should ask Dennis about the "two sticks".

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by A_MichaelUK » Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:55 pm

>No, but it answers Pinkerton's question.

Only in relation to the statement from Lucius Mothem though.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by A_MichaelUK » Wed Oct 09, 2013 6:57 pm

>- And, I even answered it without blaming her for not looking through this whole site to find it herself.
Just like that, piece of cake, see Andy ?

Yes. What a shame it wasn't the right answer in relation to Lucius Mothem's statement.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by A_MichaelUK » Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:03 pm

>I believe he was playing that night

Absolutely false. He was not "playing" but did have a personal appearance that day (I think in Massachusetts) that had been booked and advertised. This was discussed at great length on another forum at the time with Brian Nelson and according to him, it would have beens difficult albeit not impossible for Alice to attend. Everything that GNDM wrote is correct. It was actually Alice himnself who felt his presence would be a hindrance and a distraction.

>wouldn't consider cancelling the show as he wanted the money.

Another false assumption.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by A_MichaelUK » Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:05 pm

>By the way, I Think the break up was necessary

As I said yesterday, even Michael Bruce looks at that event with more objectivity than he used to. It is a shame certain people aren't able to the same.

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Re: Your biggest disappointment in Alice's career

Post by sumorider » Wed Oct 09, 2013 7:06 pm

WTMN2.
Alice and Ezrin could have done far better job.

Except "I Am Made of You"&"Under the Bed", I don't repeat.
"I Gotta Get Outta Here" has nice melody, but lyrics are terrible.

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