What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Anything Alice Cooper or AC band related goes here

Moderators: Devon, Gorehound, Si, SickThings, Shoesalesman

Post Reply
Mr.Bluelegs
Billion Dollar Baby
Billion Dollar Baby
Posts: 293
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 3:35 am

What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by Mr.Bluelegs » Sat Dec 24, 2011 6:07 am

Surprised to read in Dennis's interview that Ezrin was ready to produce the LP, but was miffed over Mike Bruce's comment regarding "Woman Machine". I wonder if he would have produced it, how different the outcome may have been. Although I love the LP, truthfully, I always felt that the drum sound on MOL (title track) needed to be punchier & louder in the mix. It's noticable during the sections when it's just Neil & Dennis playing (with no vocal). The drum sound on BDB is so powerful & perfect, yet on MOL it seems diminished. Neil's playing is still killer (especially the breaks on "Woman Machine" and the production on "Teenage Lament" is perfect) The solo on "Lament" always sounded like a Glen-style solo, I'm sure one of you know for sure who it was- maybe M. Mashbir? Again, I love the Lp & personally I feel the track sequencing might have been the "problem" as to why many feel it was sub-par. Here's my version (if anyone cares): SIDE 1- 1. Muscle 2. Never Been Sold 3. Golden Gun 4. Hard Hearted 5. Big Apple SIDE 2- 1. Sweat 2. Woman Machine 3. Crazy Little Child 4. Teenage Lament Actually, the back cover of the LP has a pretty good alternate sequence, too. Your turn....

DIMMA
Killer
Killer
Posts: 107
Joined: Sun May 30, 2010 8:02 am

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by DIMMA » Sat Dec 24, 2011 9:22 am

Mr. Bluelegs wrote "Surprised to read in Dennis's interview that Ezrin was ready to produce the LP, but was miffed over Mike Bruce's comment regarding "Woman Machine"."

This was also addressed by Mike Bruce in his book No More Mr. Nice Guy as well as by Bob Ezrin in the VH1 Behind The Music ; Alice Cooper episode.

"Neil's playing is still killer".
I agree 100%!

"The solo on "Lament" always sounded like a Glen-style solo, I'm sure one of you know for sure who it was- maybe M. Mashbir?"

I believe that may have been Mike Bruce.

A_MichaelUK
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 5383
Joined: Thu Nov 16, 2006 12:35 pm

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by A_MichaelUK » Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:18 am

>This was also addressed by Mike Bruce in his book No More Mr. Nice Guy as well as by Bob Ezrin in the VH1 Behind The Music ; Alice Cooper episode.

There was an inference to this in "Prime Cuts" as well.

pitkin88
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 4478
Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 3:25 am
Location: calif

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by pitkin88 » Sat Dec 24, 2011 3:28 pm

Which Dennis interview are you referring to?

I like your sequencing for side 1 but then you'd have two poor tracks: Woman Machine and Crazy Little Child grinding things to a halt. I'd have left off one or both of those and put in " Slick Black Limousine ". I think Ezrin would have made HHA into much more of an epic song. It certainly could have been lengthened and given a better ending. It just sort of fizzles out. The album cries out for Ezrins little touches:orchestration, sound effects etc and also for Glen. Has Ezrin ever said what he thinks about the album?

User avatar
RemarkablyInsincere
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 2800
Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2005 5:47 pm
Location: Pittsburgh, PA

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by RemarkablyInsincere » Sat Dec 24, 2011 3:30 pm

As much as I've grown to enjoy MOL over the years, initially I didn't particularly care for the album other than the title track and "Teenage Lament '74".

If I'm being really honest, the songs just aren't as good as on the 4 preceeding albums.

It's not even close. It's a big drop off.
"Golly gee it's wrong to be so guilty..."

pitkin88
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 4478
Joined: Sat Dec 09, 2006 3:25 am
Location: calif

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by pitkin88 » Sat Dec 24, 2011 3:47 pm

RemarkablyInsincere wrote:As much as I've grown to enjoy MOL over the years, initially I didn't particularly care for the album other than the title track and "Teenage Lament '74".

If I'm being really honest, the songs just aren't as good as on the 4 preceeding albums.

It's not even close. It's a big drop off.

I kind of agree. As produced by Jack Douglas it would have been much better as an ep. If Ezrin held the reins I feel we would have had a much better album and some songs would have been either jettisoned or completely rewritten.

Toronto Bob
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 974
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2005 3:01 am
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by Toronto Bob » Sat Dec 24, 2011 4:49 pm

It's a very good example of what Ezrin brought to the table. I like MoL but it's no B$B. Not every tune on B$B is a home run but somehow it all works. Mary Ann is not a great tune, but sandwiched in between ST and ILTD, provides a 2 minute respite that really enhances the album.

I wonder what Ezrin could of done with Woman Machine. That tune has a wonderful heavy, lazy riff in it and the Ezrin magic could of made it a minor epic. Same goes for Big Apple Dreamin' and MWTGG. I think leaving Slick Black Limousine off the album was the right decision - it makes for a decent B-Side but that's about it.

It seems many of us have a similiar assessment of MoL (good but not great) and that BE should have produced it. We just differ on the details.

ThePainAddict
Billion Dollar Baby
Billion Dollar Baby
Posts: 311
Joined: Sat Jul 08, 2006 5:33 am
Location: Champaign, Illinois
Contact:

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by ThePainAddict » Sat Dec 24, 2011 6:53 pm

"If Ezrin held the reins I feel we would have had a much better album and some songs would have been either jettisoned or completely rewritten"

I would suggest the latter. It seems like Ezrin didn't dump many tunes, hence, the lack of extra material from these lps. I think Bob tened to believe in his own ability to maker a silk purse out of a sow's ear. I don't think Alma Mater, Sick Things, and a few other tunes were examples of particularly strong songwriting, but Ezrin was able to make them into really effective songs.

User avatar
Shoesalesman
Little Mermaid
Little Mermaid
Posts: 15234
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:39 pm
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Contact:

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by Shoesalesman » Sat Dec 24, 2011 7:20 pm

Being a fan of showtune-Alice, Crazy Little Child ranks high. Very high.
If I may put forward a slice of personal colostomy...

Devon
Goat Herder
Goat Herder
Posts: 475
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2011 1:02 pm

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by Devon » Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:47 pm

Funnily, "Woman Machine" and "Workin' Up A Sweat" are two songs I don't care for. I thought the rest of Muscle of Love was very good though.

Had Ezrin produced it, would it have been better? That's hard telling. As highly as I think of Ezrin, and much as I think he is one of the best producers in the business, he's had to work with some less than steller material too (I'm looking at you, "Lace and Whiskey.")

In the same interview that Dennis did with Classic Rock Revisted, he mentioned that there were other factors in the band in which it started losing a little of its spark. And to think that Battle Axe could have been the next Alice Cooper album? Yikes! It also sounded like, and maybe I'm reading too much in between the lines, that Michael was wanting to take more control of the band in some form or another (especially with the comment about the disagreement with "Woman Machine" and what sounded like Bruce forcing Ezrin out and the rest of the band realizing they still needed Ezrin.) I think that if Ezrin hadn't left then, he probably would have eventually left at another time, and probably because of Michael.

killer wolf
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 776
Joined: Mon Nov 07, 2005 9:26 am
Location: DragonTown

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by killer wolf » Sun Dec 25, 2011 8:45 am

i love MoL just as it is. fantastic album IMO, not least because it's got my fave Alice track ever.
~Roses On White Lace~ A Love Story...Kinda
KW
/X\oo/X\

DIMMA
Killer
Killer
Posts: 107
Joined: Sun May 30, 2010 8:02 am

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by DIMMA » Mon Dec 26, 2011 5:58 pm

Shoesalesman wrote:Being a fan of showtune-Alice, Crazy Little Child ranks high. Very high.
I have to agree with you there Shoesalesman. Great tune and Alice´s wonderful performance makes it very poignant and touching.

Personally I think MOL is a great album but would have loved to see what Ezrin would have done with it.

The songwriting on MOL (in my opinion) is much stronger than GTH and/or L&W.
That is not to say I don´t like GTH or L&W. Except for the lame disco of "You Gotta Dance" and "No More Love" and the awful "Ubangi stomp", I think both albums have enough of the Cooper/Ezrin magic to make them great.

I hope Ezrin produces the next Alice album as well, as he always brings out the best from Alice.

User avatar
recoop
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 1886
Joined: Sat Dec 04, 2004 9:58 pm
Location: York, England

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by recoop » Mon Dec 26, 2011 7:28 pm

Interesting topic-I like MOL more now than on issue..I'm not sure Bob's input would have made the album flow better (my problem with the album originally)..after all Bob produced Lace and W. and that incorporates various musical styles and for me doesnt flow well together..no doubting Bob's effect when at his best and the material is good..what state of mind was Bob in late 73.. I think Bob would have polished up MOL a bit and I would have been glad if Woman Machine had been left off..but for me MOL is a bit of a fragmented gem with solid band playing
You are an individual, just like everybody else.

Mr.Bluelegs
Billion Dollar Baby
Billion Dollar Baby
Posts: 293
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 3:35 am

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by Mr.Bluelegs » Wed Dec 28, 2011 5:25 am

Pitkin88 asks "Which Dennis interview are you referring to?" It's the Classic Rock Revisted one that's listed under "news" on this site- Dec. 13th. As we all continue to discuss "what if's"- I wonder how Battle Axe would have differed had Alice & Bob E. been involved and wonder how "Nightmare" would have differed if the original band was involved.

Mr.Bluelegs
Billion Dollar Baby
Billion Dollar Baby
Posts: 293
Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2011 3:35 am

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by Mr.Bluelegs » Wed Dec 28, 2011 5:43 am

Forgot to mention- Has anyone ever noticed how the riff in Nazareth's "Hair of the Dog" is so similiar to "Never Been Sold Before"? I noticed it years ago. Both are great songs, but I bet Nazareth was paying attention to Alice circa 1973.

User avatar
TeresofBlood
Fashion Flusher
Fashion Flusher
Posts: 537
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2008 6:32 pm
Location: MA / VT, USA

Re: What if Ezrin produced MOL?

Post by TeresofBlood » Wed Dec 28, 2011 1:50 pm

We can't get stuck in the what-ifs. I used to cry myself to sleep every night when I learned that Jimi Hendrix asked Arthur Brown to join the Band of Gypsies, but he was ill at the time.

I don't think MOL is a great album, but it is a bery good album. The liquid flow of the album just isn't there, despite most of the tracks being solid, but many don't sound fully realized (Never Been Sold, Working Up a Sweat, for example). However, I've always enjoyed Woman Machine. DD's bass line is killer on that track, as is the Guitar work. It does lack that Ezrin flare, but it's a solid ACG track.

Post Reply