Watts in a name

Anything Alice Cooper or AC band related goes here

Moderators: Gorehound, SickThings, Devon, Si, Shoesalesman

User avatar
Headbangers Ball
Yorkshire Rose
Yorkshire Rose
Posts: 4440
Joined: Mon Jan 30, 2006 10:05 am
Location: UK

Re: Watts in a name

Post by Headbangers Ball » Tue Mar 10, 2009 5:09 pm

I don't know. I think like alot of things, it was probably just meant to be.

Personally I find the monika "Alice Cooper" alot more interesting and attention grabbing than "Nazz". And as for "Alice Cookies" - that has a bit too much 'playground' ring to it, maybe better suited to a pop group.

It also never occurred to me or my friends that any of the band were gay. It all seemed very normal, but then the 60's and 70's were definately NOT normal run of the mill times!

However, that said - whatever they had called themselves, I would of bought it anyway.
IF YOU GET UP IN THE MORNING, ITS A GOOD DAY!

glamprincess
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 757
Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 1:24 am
Location: Canada

Re: Watts in a name

Post by glamprincess » Tue Mar 10, 2009 5:22 pm

Toronto Bob wrote:gp - you started off by suggesting I didn't understand the thread - I clearly did. Next you goon to correct my opinion about good bands/bad names. This didn't need tobe corrected - it's a matter of taste and opinion. I have nothing to apologize for. I felt I was once again being attacked/corrected by you and I responded accordingly. I also PM'd you so this thread wouldn't be cluttered by this kind of back and forth.

State your opinions by all means - don't "correct" mine, as they don't need correcting. Respect.
Whoa!! Hold on. I challenge everyone reading this thread to find where I suggested that you didn't understand the thread! I NEVER did that. I was merely defending Dannorama because I interpreted his comments the way...he says that they were meant to be interpreted. I was in no way attacking you, only agreeing with Dannorama.

And I WAS THE ONE who said that band names being good/bad was a matter of opinion/taste!! Not you. And I NEVER corrected you. I challenge everyone to re-read my original post and come up with actual quotes from me where I did any of the things that you are accusing me of.

I notice that you don't come up with any actual quotes from me to support any of your accusations. It is your posts that are disrespectful, not mine.

A_MichaelUK
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 5383
Joined: Thu Nov 16, 2006 12:35 pm

Re: Watts in a name

Post by A_MichaelUK » Tue Mar 10, 2009 7:35 pm

>I'm glad you agree with me

But since we're in agreement over something which was not being discussed (at least, not by me), it's irrelevant.

User avatar
TodayMueller
Killer
Killer
Posts: 140
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2009 10:53 pm

Re: Watts in a name

Post by TodayMueller » Tue Mar 10, 2009 11:33 pm

Without going into who said what, here's my 5 cents worth:

I think the band would have had the same success named Nazz. Actually I wish it was the case, as it would probably mean they would have stayed together longer.
Vince would not be associated with the name to the same extent, thus not being able to take on a solo carreer changing his name to "Vince Nazz".
Glenn, Neal, Mike and Dennis should never had allowed Vince to take the Alice Cooper name while they were still together.
Their career would have been more like Kiss's which would have done more justice to the original band members.
I still like what Alice is doing live and I go to see him whenever he's in my neck of the woods, but I think it was a dirty trick when Vince took the band's name legally.
I myself did not realize what had happened untill Alice was well into his solo career, but looking back I can't help thinking it was wrong.

Now, hit me - I know a lot of you will not like my view.
Have no gods before me, I'm the light !

User avatar
Shoesalesman
Little Mermaid
Little Mermaid
Posts: 15175
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:39 pm
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Contact:

Re: Watts in a name

Post by Shoesalesman » Tue Mar 10, 2009 11:52 pm

TodayMueller wrote:but I think it was a dirty trick when Vince took the band's name legally.
Just my view... but I think maybe he wanted to make the name HIS because he had more to add to the character that he presented on stage or in the music and maybe he felt it should be a "seamless transition" from Alice in ACG to Alice the solo artist. Who am I to say this is even close to being right or a dirty trick, but the audience would know who Alice already was and would have a better chance to follow along rather than see some new guy doing similar things as the lead singer in ACG but not immediately realize it was the same joe.

Maybe I'm talking out my arse here, but this seems logical to me to keep the buzz going about the name Alice Cooper without losing momentum.

Can't hit you over an opinion, TodayMueller. :)
If I may put forward a slice of personal colostomy...

User avatar
TodayMueller
Killer
Killer
Posts: 140
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2009 10:53 pm

Re: Watts in a name

Post by TodayMueller » Wed Mar 11, 2009 12:17 am

Shoe Salesman, I'm glad you feel that way :)
I also think your assumptions are spot on.
Alice (Vince) did obviously think he had more to add to the name (and his own bank account), but he shouldn't exclude the other members from the success they had built up together.
Have no gods before me, I'm the light !

User avatar
Shoesalesman
Little Mermaid
Little Mermaid
Posts: 15175
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2007 4:39 pm
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Contact:

Re: Watts in a name

Post by Shoesalesman » Wed Mar 11, 2009 12:45 am

If Alice thought of finances by taking the name Alice Cooper (and I'm not saying that's the reason or suggesting he's done this) that's his thing, his business, none of my business. But I'd like to think he had more reasons to do it than for money. I'm not going to suggest he did it for the "art" only, but he seems to have more character and class than to hide behind stacks of gold coins, counting away (and I'm not saying you said this, TodayMueller, I'm just saying :) ).
If I may put forward a slice of personal colostomy...

A_MichaelUK
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 5383
Joined: Thu Nov 16, 2006 12:35 pm

Re: Watts in a name

Post by A_MichaelUK » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:41 am

>Now, hit me - I know a lot of you will not like my view.

You make some incorrect assumptions and present speculation as if it is fact. It’s an old subject which I think may have been discussed many times on this board. I invite you to search the site and the board for further information and any previous discussions.

ElectedPlus
Billion Dollar Baby
Billion Dollar Baby
Posts: 379
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 1:50 pm
Location: Japan

Re: Watts in a name

Post by ElectedPlus » Wed Mar 11, 2009 12:07 pm

Nice ... hypothetical questions that can't really be proved or dis-proved but I'd be willing to say that in an alternative universe it'll be common knowledge that The Nazz released Schools Out, B$B etc. And that within the fanbase of The Nazz, there's a message board where fans are currently discussing how important the name is to the band's success.

However, quite possibly the band's fanbase will grow slower - spreading through reputation of their live shows and image, rather than the initial punch and curiosity of a man named Alice... back in that day, the name would certainly intrege me to look for him.

Personally I don't think there's such a thing as a bad band name...trying to think of one, can't come up with anything.

User avatar
Dannorama
Fashion Flusher
Fashion Flusher
Posts: 603
Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2004 2:00 pm

Re: Watts in a name

Post by Dannorama » Wed Mar 11, 2009 12:50 pm

ElectedPlus wrote: Personally I don't think there's such a thing as a bad band name...trying to think of one, can't come up with anything.

Try this for fun!

http://progressiveboink.com/archive/worstbandnames.html
Move aside, mere drop of water - let the ocean pass.

User avatar
Gorehound
Blonde and Proud butler
Blonde and Proud butler
Posts: 2032
Joined: Sun Nov 05, 2006 2:12 pm
Location: West Yorkshire UK

Re: Watts in a name

Post by Gorehound » Wed Mar 11, 2009 10:54 pm

As a kid I remember asking mum why the hell a man would call himself Alice Cooper! And that was in the 90's. I agree with HB's comment that it was meant to be, and I think the band would still have had the same success eventually, even if things were to move a little slower without the shock of the name Alice Cooper. But I agree with what glam and people have said, the name certainly got people's attention and played a key role in events.
Flesh fanatic psychopath

User avatar
Gunner
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 1155
Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:16 pm

Re: Watts in a name

Post by Gunner » Thu Mar 12, 2009 8:37 am

I believe that the name 'Alice Cooper' had an effect, an impact, but not to the level that it significantly affected the course of the group. And I don't think the sexual ambiguity of the name directed any success before 1971. Although, it is quite possible that then name 'Alice Cooper' may have been one of the reasons that Shep and Bob were alerted to them.

However, I stand by my belief that School's Out by 'The Nazz' would have sold the same amount, the B$B show by 'The Nazz' would have been as successful and Welcome To My Nightmare by Nazz would have been as successful..it would have made Bowie's lyric 'He was the Nazz' even more poignant.

A_MichaelUK
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 5383
Joined: Thu Nov 16, 2006 12:35 pm

Re: Watts in a name

Post by A_MichaelUK » Thu Mar 12, 2009 2:16 pm

>I believe that the name 'Alice Cooper' had an effect, an impact, but not to the level that it significantly affected the course of the group.

You’re just repeating yourself which forces me to repeat myself in saying that I don’t think anyone did say “that it significantly affected the course of the group.”

>And I don't think the sexual ambiguity of the name directed any success before 1971.

No one said it did, though. I still think you under – estimate the effect it had on those who were aware of the band before the time you refer to.

>However, I stand by my belief that School's Out by 'The Nazz' would have sold the same amount, the B$B show by 'The Nazz' would have been as successful and Welcome To My Nightmare by Nazz would have been as successful..it would have made Bowie's lyric 'He was the Nazz' even more poignant.

If the above scenario had happened in the way you describe, I think Bowie wouldn't have used that lyric at all, because it would have had another meaning.

glamprincess
Dada God
Dada God
Posts: 757
Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 1:24 am
Location: Canada

Re: Watts in a name

Post by glamprincess » Thu Mar 12, 2009 4:19 pm

Good post, Gorey.

Would the band have been as successful as The Nazz or using some other name? It's the type of question where we will never know the answer because none of us has a crystal ball and can know what would have happened in an alternate universe.

And you know how alternate universes can be: if any one thing is changed, then another thing happens differently, and that in turn changes another factor, etc. So everything could have turned out very differently.

For example, assume the following hypothetical situation: If the ACG decided to keep the name The Nazz, then they may not have gone with such a sexually ambiguous image. Reportedly Bob Ezrin was fascinated by the ACG's sexually confusing image (as were rock fans when "I'm Eighteen" became a hit). Ezrin may not have found the band as interesting if instead of the androgynous Alice Cooper, the band had been The Nazz with a different image. And if Ezrin hadn't been interested in them, I think one can assume that things would not have been the same without Bob Ezrin. So in an alternate universe with a different name, I think it's possible that things could have turned out totally different. And we'll never know anyhow unless we have some kind of crystal ball.

Personally, I think it's good that they went with the name Alice Cooper because they ended up becoming a rock phenomenon all around the world. Since things could have turned out differently with a different name, image, etc., it probably worked out for the best with Alice Cooper.

Post Reply