WTMN part 2?

[glamprincess]

If the coop Wagner and Ezrin wanted this to happen they would schedule and make it happen .

Criss, I am just quoting one of your previous posts to try and clarify what I think Andy was just trying to say. Your comment here seems to suggest that if Alice, Dick and Bob wanted to work together then they would make it happen. But Andy was just pointing out that sometimes people can want to work together but there are sheduling conflicts and other projects they are working on which could get in the way. It doesn't necessarily mean that all the parties are not interested, simply that things are not always so simple and people may have conflicting schedules due to other responsibilities. I think that's what Andy was getting at.

[WickedYoungMan]

Lets not forget that Wagner and Alice *did* some work together here a couple of years ago for what might have ended up on the new album which obviously didn't happen. Heck, the current band's stuff barely even made it to the album. If I recall correctly, it took Dick Wagner moving across the country just to have any time to work with Alice. No I'm not saying that is the sole purpose that he moved but I believe that is when they were able to finally do some work together.

Also Bob Ezrin isn't very proactive in producing these days it seems. If I also recall, he was working with Universal Music Group in Toronto (I think). I don't know if this would have anything though.

[Gunner]

I don't understand what all this 'WTMN 2' thing is, I don't think for one minute that WTMN is close to his best work....a lot of 'hype' for that album I think. For me, only PFY, Constrictor, The Last Temptation, Dirty Diamonds and ACAS are considered 'lesser' works.

[criss]

If the coop Wagner and Ezrin wanted this to happen they would schedule and make it happen .

Criss, I am just quoting one of your previous posts to try and clarify what I think Andy was just trying to say. Your comment here seems to suggest that if Alice, Dick and Bob wanted to work together then they would make it happen. But Andy was just pointing out that sometimes people can want to work together but there are sheduling conflicts and other projects they are working on which could get in the way. It doesn't necessarily mean that all the parties are not interested, simply that things are not always so simple and people may have conflicting schedules due to other responsibilities. I think that's what Andy was getting at.

Thanx i had a general idea what he was on about but as he stated in his last post he expects me to Defend my points . And this in a nut shell is why i let this go , as in my view many of andys questions come across as an attack that he expects me to defend its not a discussion , attack + defend is nt fun in my book . I know a forum is inpersonal and i could be reading more into this than i should and if i am i apologise .

[A_MichaelUK]

>its not a discussion

It isn't?! Why are you here then?

> i could be reading more into this than i should

Yes, you are.

>and if i am i apologise .

No apology required, but accepted since it was offered. That said, the idea, that you think you can post anything you like without justifying it or clarifying it as required, is strange.

[Si]

Perhaps when Andy says "Defend" your points he simply means "support" your points with reasons or illustrations why you believe it to be the case. That is how I took it to mean anyway.

Andy tries to show you and others the possible flaws in your reasoning. He's maybe just not as subtle as maybe I or Glam, for example, would be! I would hope that if you (or anyone) came back with "I think this because of a, b and c leads me to think this is possible" then Andy would at least say that he can see where you are coming from even if he didn't agree with you.

On topic:
I think the assumption that an Alice/Ezrin/Wagner combination would automatically create a classic is deeply flawed. It would certainly be interesting to US but there is no guarentee at all that 30 years on from their classic period they would hit gold again. They are all different people, likely pulling in different directions, especially if you compare what Alice has done recently and Dick's latest material. They are worlds apart. That isn`t to say they couldn`t come up with something great, simply that it isn`t guarenteed.

Dick and Alice, as WYM mentioned, did do some writing a short while back, but nothing from this has surfaced. This could be for many reasons including the songs not being compatable with other songs Alice wanted to use, the producers prefering to do their own songs, or even horror of horrors, them not being that great (it's possible, admit it). WE don't know, as we've never heard them.
Add to that Dicks recent medical problems and I should think recouperation is far higher on his agenda then any collaborations at this point, and so it should be.

[A_MichaelUK]

>This could be for many reasons including the songs not being compatable with other songs Alice wanted to use, the producers prefering to do their own songs, or even horror of horrors, them not being that great (it's possible, admit it).

Exactly. This reminds me that, apparently, Bob Ezrin and Dick Wagner did some writing for "The Last Temptation" and none of it was used.

[Gunner]

Exactly. This reminds me that, apparently, Bob Ezrin and Dick Wagner did some writing for "The Last Temptation" and none of it was used.

You know? I would love to know how much work for Cooper albums has been done that hasn't been used. I mean, for example, there was 'stuff' he did for a WTMN2 in 1983 that never got used. Does anyone know what happened to that, is it available to hear anywhere???

[A_MichaelUK]

>You know? I would love to know how much work for Cooper albums has been done that hasn't been used.

Go to:
http://www.sickthingsuk.co.uk/misc/unreleased.php for lots of interesting information.

[Toronto Bob]

Not sure if I care for doing album sequels but saying that, WTMN is a special Alice album and I can see why the idea would be considered.

A couple of thought about what made that album so great

- great song writing (OWB,WTMN, Cold Ethyl)
- wide variety of sounds and styles
- monster riffage from DW and SH
- variety of instrumantation (harpsichord, strings, horns in addition to usual rock band stuff)
- cool little stories

I feel this was a very experimental album for Alice and he hasn't stepped out of formulaic song writing since 1983's DA DA.

If he would take on a project like a WTMN sequal, it's fraught with artistic pitfalls. I don't believe he's willing or capable of creating music outside of the musical norms like he used to. He either runs the risk of repeating himself or WTMN ends up a boring, vastly inferior sequal to a landmark album.

My advice - approach with caution! Hey maybe that could be the title! There you go Alice - my gift to you.

[criss]

Perhaps when Andy says "Defend" your points he simply means "support" your points with reasons or illustrations why you believe it to be the case. That is how I took it to mean anyway.

Andy tries to show you and others the possible flaws in your reasoning. He's maybe just not as subtle as maybe I or Glam, for example, would be! I would hope that if you (or anyone) came back with "I think this because of a, b and c leads me to think this is possible" then Andy would at least say that he can see where you are coming from even if he didn't agree with you.

On topic:
I think the assumption that an Alice/Ezrin/Wagner combination would automatically create a classic is deeply flawed. It would certainly be interesting to US but there is no guarentee at all that 30 years on from their classic period they would hit gold again. They are all different people, likely pulling in different directions, especially if you compare what Alice has done recently and Dick's latest material. They are worlds apart. That isn`t to say they couldn`t come up with something great, simply that it isn`t guarenteed.

Dick and Alice, as WYM mentioned, did do some writing a short while back, but nothing from this has surfaced. This could be for many reasons including the songs not being compatable with other songs Alice wanted to use, the producers prefering to do their own songs, or even horror of horrors, them not being that great (it's possible, admit it). WE don't know, as we've never heard them.
Add to that Dicks recent medical problems and I should think recouperation is far higher on his agenda then any collaborations at this point, and so it should be.

I totaly agree there s no guarantee that Coop Ezrin and Wagner would produce a classic hit , but i can dream . I guess im just hoping one day they will get back toghter , and one never knows maybe they will , i for one hope so .

I would hope that one day the demos they did will get a release . And your 100% correct all that matters is that dick is happy and on the mend .